View Full Version : what do you do if your "100%" hets aren't?

Casey Hulse
05-29-2002, 07:07 PM
Yesterday I had a thrill. My 9 ft 100% "het" that I purchased last year as an adult and bred with a VERIFIED microchip implanted (by Pete Kahl) 100% het male, gave birth to 41 BIG FAT 100% normal looking baby columbians. Not an albino in the bunch. Talk about a major dissapointment.
I did not even buy the "het" from Jesse Underhill. As a matter of fact, the person I bought it from hasn't dissapeared at all , they are still posting on Kingsnake. What would everyone do in the same situation?


05-30-2002, 02:45 AM
hmm easy pick up the phone and well ... the rest goes like this ... hiya there im so n so .. i bought a 100%het from you that i think you must have mistakenly sold me a "poss" het inturn? as ( tell them bout the 100% male breeder PK snake)
then offer to send proof of her gravid and her babies .... then i would inturn  possibly looking for $$ restitution on the difference or something done to make me happy as i would have been wrongly represented  being sold a 100% het ( albino i presume and if it was adult i presume it wasnt exactly cheap?i would approach it as calm untill given the reason to hafta take it up a level if it is that big of a deal to you that you ay have invested in a snake you thought to breed and produce albinos , and was the sole reason for buying it ... but i would no matter the deal make this known ..
just thoughts at almost 3 am ..... g night

Casey Hulse
05-30-2002, 08:29 AM
That is pretty much what I figured I would do. This person must not answer his e-mails very often... 2 days and counting.. Thanx!

05-30-2002, 11:30 AM
Casey, Bad News for ya.  It is entirely possible for a het to het breeding not to produce ANY double recessive offspring.  Now according to the statistics you should have had 25% of the litter born albino (about ten snakes).  But remember these are only statistics.  It really comes down to which sperm swam the fastest to which egg.  It may be that you have two true hets but produced no recessive offspring.  Basically every baby coming down the shoot had a one in four chance of being albino, just like everytime you throw a die it has a one in six chance of landing on 6.  So really you don't have much of a leg to stand on.  That's the bad part about buying hets.

Another thing, are you sure they were het for the same strain of albinism?

Darin Chappell
05-30-2002, 03:28 PM
I have to agree with the above post.  You certainly will want to contact the person from whom you made your purchase so that he/she will be aware of your concerns.  However, you really need to have another successful breeding (or two) with nothing but normals as the outcome before you could say that you had more solid evidence (even this isn't absolute -- it COULD be really bad luck).  

You might want to breed her to an animal that is homozygous for the trait that she is supposed to be het for.  That would up the percentages in your favor and solidify your case when asking for a refund.

Just a thought

05-31-2002, 12:40 AM
I have to agree with Brain. Now if you were to breed her to an Albino and get all normals then that would be a differnt story. Frank

05-31-2002, 07:16 PM
Yes, het to double recessive increases your odds to 50%.  It would still be possible to get all the normal phenotype, but much less likely.

Classic Dum's
06-03-2002, 12:34 AM
I agree with what some of the others have said I would contact the guy but not get to wound up over it, it is very possible for 100% hets not to produce, I know Brian Sharp had some 100% albino ball pythons hets he produce himself and two years in a row got all normals from his own hets, so best of luck..........

Steve M.
06-03-2002, 02:07 PM
the above post's are correct I breed my 100% hets for the first time this year and out of 24 babies I only got 2 albinos not exactly 25% I bought them from peter kahl and called to ask some questions and pete told exactly whats posted above, genetics are a bit of a gamble

06-03-2002, 08:34 PM
If you do have two 100% hets for albino.....

Man I am not taking you to vegas.

Donnie Smith
06-04-2002, 01:05 PM
Since I am a math junkie, here is a set of neet statistics for you:

The chances of having 41 baby boas, each having a 25% chance of being albino and having exactly no albinos is:


I have seen lotterys with better payoffs.  Given that really slim chance, it is theoretically Possible that it could happen, but it is not real likely.  

I would probably ask for my money back if I were in your situation. :-)

-Your Sick Uncle Morti.

Donnie Smith
06-04-2002, 01:11 PM
I'm sorry... I mistyped...

The real probability is 0.000754244%

I added a zero there at the begining.  Still slim.