Leshock Albinos???

[Intense Herpetoculture]

Anyone ever get chance to see these in person or get to work with them?
Thanks
Justyn

[Monte]

. . . I must be out of the loop.

Does that mean there is another variant of albinism out there. LV, Tremper, Bell and now LeShock.?

[Intense Herpetoculture]

Yeah, they were the first albino leo to be hatched in captivity in 1996, prior to Trempers hatchling. I can send you a couple pics of what they look like if you would like. I do not know anyone who is currently working with them.

[Xavier]

I'd like to see them too if that ok
xavier.springer@tlab.aorcentaf.af.mil

[Herpcam]

If you've got the purple cover edition, you can see a Leshock albino on page 64. I think I remember some in Reptiles magazine a few years ago, also.

[diablohogs]

is the Leshock albino a seperate strain of albinism is the real question. trempers and bells are not compatible strains of albinism nor are las vegas (rainwaters). these are 3 seperate strains of albinism that when bred together create double hets (wonder what a double homozygous bell/tremper would look like) and not albinos.

so was the leshock albino just a tremper before ron tremper popped out with one... or are there actually 4 strains of albinism???

[Herpcam]

I've never asked anyone involved, but it seems people would like us to believe that it is/was a 4th strain, even if it's by them not making it public what really happened with them. I've wondered what happened to them and wondered if they weren't bought from Leshock by the Bells, Rainwater, or Tremper to 'create' their line. I know at least one of the 3 lines out there were bought by their namesake's, but can't remember which one. Don't get me wrong, I'm not accusing anyone of anything negative, but that's what I have wondered may have happened since Leshock albinos never really hit the market in the US.

I can't believe they simply disappeared. Justyn has more info on them.

[Intense Herpetoculture]

Ahh, give me a bit and I'll post some info on here.

[diablohogs]

Ahh, give me a bit and I'll post some info on here.


im still wondering....

[Intense Herpetoculture]

Well, I got tired of a million people e-mailing me and figured I would just shut up about the whole thing until I got it all worked out and understand the Leshock strain better, if it is in fact a seperate strain. I'll have a good idea soon enough. You'll just have to wait like the rest of us. I am currently the only person working with the Leshock strain and it appears I will not know for sure if it is a seperate starin until next year, but like I said I'll have a very good idea in a few months. I've been so busy with everything lately, plus I have thought about it, and if you truely want to know more about the Leshock strain, perhaps you can read about it in a future publication, no need to spill the beans quite yet.

[beakgeek]

If you can get a blood sample you can get a DNA analysis done on it. Comparing it to the other albino strains will prove lineage.

How do you know it is a Leshock strain if it appears no one really knows anything about it?

Very cool stuff.

Regards,

Terry

[Intense Herpetoculture]

Before you cna use DNA to prove it is a seperate strain of albino, you need to pin point what part of the DNA strain represents the albino gene for each morph, just too costly. So in the real world, no, you can not prove it is a seperate albino strain that way, not in todays world.

As for knowing it is a Leshock strain, perhaps I aquired the animl form Leshock himself! There is some info knwon about it, but very little, and you can only aquire this info after extremely persistant investigatory work.

[beakgeek]

Agreed it might be costly, but if you look at the mitochondrial dna it is possible. You get samples from the known strains, and compare them. The patterns in the DNA from the gells will show you which alleles are for albinism. Once you know that you look at the similarities in the patterns of the DNA of all the strains of albinos and can determine the maternal lineage. That would prove if Leshock is its own strain or related.

I worked in a lab that does mitochondrial dna analysis on birds, and we were able to prove lineage for a number of bird species. Including where the species split into their own genus etc.

This stuff is so cool.

Regards,

Terry

[Intense Herpetoculture]

Agreed it might be costly, but if you look at the mitochondrial dna it is possible. You get samples from the known strains, and compare them. The patterns in the DNA from the gells will show you which alleles are for albinism. Once you know that you look at the similarities in the patterns of the DNA of all the strains of albinos and can determine the maternal lineage. That would prove if Leshock is its own strain or related.


Sorry, but it will be easier, faster, and cheaper to prove this albino strain out without the use of looking at mitochondrial DNA. It could possibly take years to understand which sequence represents the albino gene, and what is worse is for each albino strain it would be separate. Sure, it is possible, but it is also possible for me to bred two albino genes together to see if they are in fact separate strains. I mean, heck, let's be realistic here, just how long do you propose it would take to find the albino gene sequence for each strain? Just how much would it cost, would it be worth it?

I worked in a lab that does mitochondrial DNA analysis on birds, and we were able to prove lineage for a number of bird species. Including where the species split into their own genus etc.


I am very familiar with the method you described above, well, lets just say extremely familiar. What is different about the this method to see which animals are more closely related compared to finding the occurrence of an exact gene mutation is that when proving the lineage of closely related animals to show a genetic tree you are just comparing the similarities between two or more species. Two species that show many of the similar patterns are more likely to be related then a species that does. This is very different from pin pointing an exact gene. In fact, it is a lot cheaper too, and even myself with a small amount of dedicated friends working in that field could easily pull that off for a few hundred dollars, but it still would not help me pin point the albino gene for each strain.

[KelliH]

Fingers are crossed on LeShock being a seperate strain, then we can do this:

:beer:

[beakgeek]

I am in total aggreement with you - not trying discredit your albino. Just offering alternatives. The one you bring up regarding breeding your Leshock with other strains to see if the trait shows up is simple and elegant. I was just trying to hammer a nail with a sledgehammer.

Good luck.

Terry

[Intense Herpetoculture]

Terry,

Hehehehe, just please understand that on this forum I am never trying to start a fight, just trying to offer a healthy discussion. I enjoy your views on this forum, always feel mroe then welcome to post, we need as many people as we can get. As for discrediting the LeShock albino, no offence taken, I don't even know if the LeShock will turn out to be seperate strain or not, that's why I plan to find out. I say it is a seperate strain, but who knows. Sometimes the simple way is the best way!


Kelli,

Hahahaha, we will being doing this :beer: !!!