John Moore (MooreSnakes) BAD GUY

At the Tucson show, John Moore tried to trade us two normal 05 boas as 66% possible het for Sunglows for our tame female GTP, and then thretened to KILL me, not once but, three times when we declined on the offer for obvious reasons and attempted to explain why. Here is the whole rundown.

My buddy, Tom and I decided to get a table at the Tucson Reptile Show. As many here know, I mostly work with Rosy Boas right now. However, I have worked with boas in the past, and I am helping Tom with a couple BCI morph projects as well. Tom is really excited about Boas and some of the interesting morphs that are available, so I have been helping him out with some of the basic genetics and how they work.

Anyway, Tom has a really nice 03 female GTP that he brought to the show. The really cool thing about her is that she is actually totally tame. He was hoping to sell her to possibly help fund one of his boa morph acquisitions. It was not easy to keep him behind the table, as he was like a kid in a candy story. Upon return from one of his shopping trips he asked me if I could look at something with him that did not make any sense to him. I asked him what it was, and he told me that John Moore from "Mooresnakes" was offering him 0.2 66% possible het for Sunglow Boas in partial trade for his GTP. I told tom it sounded great (almost too great) since he already had a pair, and he could either add them to the group or sell them. I asked Tom what was so confusing about the offer, and he told me that they looked like normal boas. He then asked me, "if they are het for Sunglow wouldn't they have to be hypos?" I had spent a great deal of time explaining genetics to Tom in the past, and I was very happy to see that he understood what I had taught him. I told him that he was correct in that they did have to be hypo to be het, or even possible het, for Sunglow. I explained to him that they were probably just ugly hypos, and that I would not mind checking them out for him.

I know John only through another mutual friend, and I have personally never had a problem with him (mostly because I just steer clear of him), but I have heard about many very bad encounters that other unfortunate souls have had with him. I had heard that John has an impulse control problem that when combined with his very large size and lack of brains, had landed him in the prison at least once for nearly beating a police officer to death. I had heard all these stories about him, and the last thing I wanted to do is to get this guy angry. So we go over there and Tom asks him if he still has those Boas. John then pulled two totally normal boas off of the back table, and I am thinking in my head "this is just great (sarcasm)"... At this point I was saying silent prayers for my safety, and then Tom handed them to me and said five unthinkable words. He said, "what do you think James?" At that point time came to a complete stop. After gathering my composure, I said, "well I am a little confused; these do not look like hypos to me." John then replied that they were not hypos and that they were 66% possible het for hypo and albino, and that they were from Shane Kinney. He then told me that I did not know $h!t about boas and I better shut my mouth. So at this point, I am thinking in my head, "that went well (sarcasm), time to smooth things over fast!" I explained to him that there must be a misunderstanding between him and Shane as these are not hypo, and that hypomelanism in Boa Constrictors is a co-dominant trait, meaning that the hets are the hypos, and therefore cannot be het, or even possible het, for Sunglow. He then informed me if I said another word he would kill me. At this point I should I mention that John is a 300 pound skin-headed tattooed convicted felon whose equally large partner is standing there shaking his head in disapproval with very conspicuous revolver holstered at his waist?

Anyway, things were not going well for me at that point. I tried telling him that I was doing him a favor by telling him this before he sold them to someone. I tried to explain the genetics to him in a adult manor in spite of the verbal abuse he continued to dish out. He then pulled out the receipt that he had from Shane which stated 0.2 66% possible het albino (sunglow siblings). He then said, How do you explain that? If they have sunglow siblings they have to be possible het for Sunglow!" I Immediately realized what Shane meant, and also how John misunderstood it. I told him that it was an easy mistake to make, and that these babies would have to be the result of a hypo het for albino x normal het for albino breeding. He then demanded that I shut my mouth (again), and informed me that I knew nothing of Boa genetics. He grabbed his phone, called Shane, and handed it to Tom who was still in total shock. Shane confirmed exactly what I had said, in that the breeding that produced these babies was indeed a hypo het for albino x normal het for albino pairing. John still did not understand, then asked me to come back with him behind his table, so I went back (against my better judgment). He then leaned right into my face and said, "you just blew my deal, if I ever see you anywhere near my table or anywhere else, I will kill you before you know what even happened."

I then said this to him, "John, I am not trying to cause any problem with you. I am trying very hard to be a nice guy here, but it is getting me nowhere. I did not blow your deal. You blew any chance of a possible deal, by misrepresenting the animals and by the way you are acting now. What do you want me to do? Do you expect me to lie to my friend and tell him to trade his GTP for these boas? I am not going to do that." John then reiterated his threat to kill me for the third time. I then politely asked him one last time if he wanted me to sit down with him and explain the genetics (or lack of) with these animals. He said, "no". Realizing, at that point, that it was time to get the hell out of there, I said, "then we are done", and stepped back out to a safer area outside of his booth (the whole time questioning myself for ever entering the Lion's den in the first place. John then actually asked Tom if he would do the deal, and Tom said he would pass and we left.

I take death treats very serious, so I immediately informed the show promoter what had just gone down, and I will most likely be filing a police report today. I would welcome any suggestions on how to handle this?

Watch your back and the Runt's as well.

Thanks Wes, I will.

"Wow, you are making friends fast James."

Tell me about it!

"First make sure your address is no where to be found."

Anyone's address can be found (some may be more difficult than others, but if someone wants your address bad enough, they will get it.

"A police report may be helpful to some degree, but he may never answer the door when the go over."

They do not have to visit him for me to file a report. I just think it should be on record.

"What did the show promoter do?"

He was not surprised and he was upset. Beyond that I do not know...

First of all, I want to make it crystal clear right up front. I would not threaten to kill anyone over a snake. James Wilson is stretching the truth about this incident way beyond the facts. I had two boas from Shane Kinney. I had a reciept stating that they were 66% het for albino and that they had (albino,sunglow siblings). I in no way was trying to mislead anyone, nor would i ever. I have been selling snakes for a long with very few complaints. James Wilson came to our table, one that I paid good money to operate, and was making a scene in front of my customers. I told him to step away from the table more than once and he kept persisting. My buddy was shaking his head in the background, because he new that James was pressing his luck. I got angry with the guy. I asked him to leave my table and he wouldn't. I took him to the side and told him I would kick his %$# if he did not move from my space immediatley. I am sorry for this because i know violance is not the answer. I am only human and i was very embarrased that this situation happened out in the open like it did. The proper way to handle things would have been for james to take me to the side, and handle things in private rather than in front of paying customers. To respond to his remarks about us being head shaved, tattooed, gun carrying criminals, the last i checked this is America, and we have the right to cut our hair and tattoo anything we want. In the great state of Arizona we have the right to bare arms, and we choose to do so. I think being away from home carrying thousands of dollars around with you is a legitimate reason to carry a firearm. It is not intended to threaten people in anyway. If it could legally be concealed we would do so. My friend does not have a concealed weapons permit, so on his hip it went. He did not threaten anyone with it, as a matter of fact he did not get into our conversation at all, for james to bring him into it is just silly. As far as i am concerned its water under the bridge. I sold every snake on the table but one, so obviously the customers did not think we were thugs. I appologies for this thread being brought to this BOI. I know there should be more important things to discuss than the ramblings of James Wilson.
James Wilson you are forgiven but not forgotten.

Thanks for your time. JOHN MOORE (MOORESNAKES)

Originally Posted by MOORESNAKES

James Wilson you are forgiven but not forgotten.

It always lends credibility to your more or less reasonably worded post to end it with a veiled threat.

Hi. Do you have a website where you sell snow rosy boas? If so, can you please e-mail it to me? Can you also e-mail me prices as well? My e-mail is iceman0000003@yahoo.com. Thanks. -Mike

Originally Posted by iceman0000003

Hi. Do you have a website where you sell snow rosy boas? If so, can you please e-mail it to me? Can you also e-mail me prices as well? My e-mail is iceman0000003@yahoo.com. Thanks. -Mike

He has stopped selling animals for a while.
Too much BS in this industry.
Top notch rosies but you will need to look elsewhere.

Originally Posted by SPJ

He has stopped selling animals for a while.
Too much BS in this industry.
Top notch rosies but you will need to look elsewhere.

Steve,
James has gotten out of the biz??
If so that is a big time crime.

John E Dove

He may one day come back but for now he is out of the reptile business.
Nice guy with great animals. We need more guys like him in the biz.