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Board of Inquiry® This forum is provided exclusively for the discussion of specific persons or businesses in the herp industry. YOUR FULL NAME is required for each message you post.

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Old 04-09-2012, 08:55 PM   #1
Baileykm
Andrew Potts- I want my money back

The story between Andrew Potts and myself goes back a few months. I sent him money for a 2011 Hytec Parahet Male. I wished for the snake to arrive during the spring time because I live in Chicago and seeing single digit days is not that uncommon during the winter. I did not wish to risk the snake arriving dead.

The snake arrived in March dead on arrival. The box had a slight smell to it before I even opened it up and I figured it was simply feces. The snake was shipped fine in that the there was Styrofoam, news paper ect. The snake however was dead, limp, and stinking like something on the side of the road after a few days. This did not raise any suspicions for me because mistakes happen. I understand this completely. My friend asked me about the shipping process and hours it was in the crate and many other questions. She was leading me to look into the death of the snake more closely and asked me about its rigor mortis, its pooling of blood, and a few other questions. All these questions lead to a time of death much later then simply "in the mail death".

All the things I have said can be proved by the pictures and video I took of the snake when I first opened the package and again a day later.

So now I have a dead snake on my hands and was talking with Andrew (who was completely helpful until this point) and I overnighted the snake back to him at his request. On the tracking number it was listed as destroyed at customers request. At this point I was thinking oh no, why is that? I called Fedex and there was an E-note attached to it stating that the driver found the stench too much and had to open it up and find the deceased snake. This was after 2 layers of freezer bags, coffee grounds, and a tupperware container mind you and this animal was only in my hands for less then 2 days.

This is where my complaint comes in. Andrew Potts said he would be willing to help only AFTER he received the deceased snake. So now I am having to look up laws as to what state I must sue in to have my money returned to me. I am asking for the initial cost of the snake plus the 75 dollars to overnight the snake from Chicago to Florida.

If you have any questions feel free to ask them and I will respond the best I can.
 
Old 04-09-2012, 09:19 PM   #2
barbie
Can we see the pics? And how much time have you givin him to return your money? Doe he know about the thread? If thier are any emails or text please post those also!
 
Old 04-09-2012, 09:20 PM   #3
Baileykm
Sure thing, I will post the pics up onto imgur so give me a sec. As for the emails let me pull them up. I will be back in less then 10 minutes
 
Old 04-09-2012, 09:21 PM   #4
barbie
And has he disagreed to pay you back becaus
e they killed the snake?
 
Old 04-09-2012, 09:24 PM   #5
barbie
well destroyed the package?
 
Old 04-09-2012, 09:28 PM   #6
Baileykm
Kevin, He's in route and will be there tomorrow. Make sure someone is there to sign, otherwise the driver cant deliver, I paid extra to get a signature. Here's the tracking number......798185339693. Take care and talk with soon. Andrew

Kevin Bailey
Mar 20

to apotts60
Andrew bad news. It arrived dead. I am taking pictures of it now and putting it in a ziplock bag. gimme a call.

Kevin Bailey Mar 29 (12 days ago)
Hey just checking in to see when I should expect to see those snake pictures

apotts60@aol.com
Mar 29 (11 days ago)

to me
Mr Bailey, as mentioned in a previous e-mail, until I receive the deceased 2011 male Orange-tail Hytec Parahet #2, I will not make any effort to resolve this situation. Andrew Potts

Kevin Bailey
Mar 31 (10 days ago)

to apotts60
Andrew, I do not know what sort of address you have. I have mailed a check there twice and it only got there after you called me and confirmed who I was even though I used the same address both times. This time I mailed the snake on the 22nd overnight for 73 .56. I presumed I had no worries about it since I used the exact same address you gave me already. This time the package was destroyed because the damn thing smelled so bad AFTER the address was not acceptable. I have attached pictures proving I held my end up and the tracking number which also shows the dates and times.

Tracking no.: 800112993548
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DSC00936.JPG
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apotts60@aol.com
Mar 31 (10 days ago)

to me
Mr Bailey, I'll say it once again, until I receive the deceased boa, I will not move a centimeter forward to resolve this issue. Andrew Potts


-----Original Message-----
From: Kevin Bailey <baileykm86@gmail.com>
To: apotts60 <apotts60@aol.com>

Kevin Bailey
Mar 31 (10 days ago)

to apotts60
I would like my money back then.

My address is


apotts60@aol.com
Mar 31 (10 days ago)

to me
Mr Bailey, In an earlier e-mail I said nothing will happen until I receive the deceased boa. Please do what you must but I stand by my previous statement. Andrew Potts


-----Original Message-----
From: Kevin Bailey <baileykm86@gmail.com>
To: apotts60 <apotts60@aol.com>

Kevin Bailey
Mar 31 (9 days ago)

to apotts60
Your request is not going to happen. As I told you before the snake stunk. The animal arrived post rigor mortis which happens after 3 days. The snake was limp and not hard. Also happening at the same time is this, Hydrogen-Sulfide escapes from bacterial decomposition (usually starts around the stomach and intestine areas). This means it smells. This happens after 36 hours. The body had blood pools already very pronounced that happens from 12-36 hours. Then the mouth of the animal was at a 180 degree from its upper jaw. I was unable to receive an explanation for what would cause the snakes mouth to do that. Finally we come to what this all means.

With your tracking number I noticed the snake was only in transit for a total of 20 hours. I think you can see how the math does not add up and a dead snake was sent to me.

Now regarding your not budging before you receive the dead snake. It is impossible. That hydrogen sulfide I was talking to you about earlier in the email (the dead animal smell we all know so well) was so potent that not only did it escape 2 freezer ziplock bags surrounded by saran and in a Tupperware container. Furthermore, I used coffee grounds to mask the smell more. Coffee grounds as I am sure you know mask smells amazingly. That is why stores use it to cleanse the nose palate when you are buying colognes and perfumes. This can all be vouched for by my friend Rommel who was in from California and watched me do this. Now the next thing I did was send the snake overnight to your address that I used previously to send you the check (yes I still have that email of you giving me your address). Now I called fedex to figure out what is going on with this customer requested destruction. They had a note on it saying that the stench was so terrible that they could not handle it past the Tampa hub so they opened it up, found a dead snake, and then destroyed the said snake.

So this brings me back to my next point. I want my 4575.48 back or a Sharp Strain Albino Aztec.

The 75.48 comes from the overnight Fedex that I used to return the snake.

I used my real address here

On Sat, Mar 31, 2012 at 3:04 PM, <apotts60@aol.com> wrot


apotts60@aol.com
Mar 31 (9 days ago)

to me
Mr. Bailey. In a word no. End of discussion. Andrew Potts


-----Original Message-----
From: Kevin Bailey <baileykm86@gmail.com>
To: apotts60 <apotts60@aol.com>

Kevin Bailey
Mar 31 (9 days ago)

to apotts60
then my money


Kevin Bailey
Apr 1 (8 days ago)

to apotts60
So I am going to assume that you are keeping my money and not sending me a snake. I will be contacting a lawyer here to figure out what state BAR certified lawyer I need, IL or Fl.
 
Old 04-09-2012, 09:38 PM   #7
Baileykm
Forgot this one:
March 20th
Kevin, I'm not requesting that you return the deceased boa to be a pain but it's needed for any possible insurance claim we might be able to pursue with our Insurance carrier. I know it's asking allot to put it in the refrigerator but it's important it be as fresh as possible for agent inspection and I also must ask you to ship the boa back tomorrow. The sooner after death we file a claim of this nature the less hassle involved. Again I'm so sorry for the inconvenience and genuinely thank you for your patience and level headedness during a high stress situation. The claim I'm talking about is not with FedEx but unfortunately I did mention to Sean about filing a claim with FedEx if it was delivered after three(late delivery) and I wanted him to lie about the contents increasing the chance of FedEx approving the claim. Andrew

March 21st
Kevin, It just occured to me that Sean thinks I'm filing a claim with FedEx and need his help, I don't. FYI I couldn't file a claim for anything from FedEx because the package was delivered on time and I had no declared value. The Insurance claim is with the company I have our boa and ball collections insured with, most big breeders have similar insurance and coverage. I don't need any statements or anything from anyone other than the deceased animal or photos, preferably the deceased animal. So please send photos and the deceased boa.

How does our conversation end on such an upbeat note and then I get a nasty e-mail from Sean and It appears with your support. I have to ask, do you think I'm trying to rip you off..? Do you think you deserve more than you purchased because of an unintentional mistake...? Please call me or e-mail, Its very important we resolve this one way or the other. Take care and hope to talk soon, Andrew


I also provided the photos:
http://imgur.com/IA9a8,tirLZ,V9Rwn,7...MP,Qll1K,PynB8
 
Old 04-09-2012, 09:40 PM   #8
barbie
have you told him about this thread?
 
Old 04-09-2012, 09:47 PM   #9
Baileykm
No I have not. I know he has a squeaky clean reputation that is why I went with him. Now as for him not returning my money... I can not talk for him. He apparently really wanted the snakes body which has been destroyed (even though pictures were supposed to be good enough). I am just doing my amazon.com-style review of a seller.

I do not understand what he is trying to do. I am just glad I decided to keep things mostly through email instead of phonecalls that way I have a recorded track record of what has happened.
 
Old 04-09-2012, 09:47 PM   #10
barbie
Are the pics from the same day you recieved the snake? That poor thing it looks like its been dead for days
 

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