Stephen Carnicom AKA "scarnicom" is SHADY

Originally Posted by Southern Wolf

There have been alot of people on the BOI that have been labeled (and dare I say... proven) to be a bad guy because of unethnical business dealings. Just because money didnt exchange hands doesn't mean you cant be a bad guy in business.

You take someone that doctors their for sale photos to make them look better than they really are... are they not bad guys even though money hasnt changed hands.

You take someone that steals other people photos and represents them as their own.... are they not bad guys even though money hasnt changed hands.

You take someone that sells the same animal over and over using the same photo.... are they not bad guys even though money hasnt changed hands.

The point I am trying to make is this.... Bad Business Ethics = Bad Guy. Maybe... just maybe... the fact that these issues getting brought out before money changes hands will save someone from having to fight to get their money back. If your gonna do shady stuff in the beginning... then your gonna do shady stuff when something goes wrong with the transaction.

That is making a great deal of assumptions though. Who is to say this guy is not just an inexperienced seller who does not realize that his actions make him questionable? He was not misrepresenting an animal, that would be a different situation all together. No matter if money is involved or not. None of the evidence shown makes it out that this guy was misrepresenting anything or purposefully trying to scam someone. No proof means it did not happen.

You state yourself that maybe the fact that these issues getting brought out before money changes hands will save someone ... well, that is a big maybe and, again, an assumption. Maybe he would have been able to debate the point to him that the agreed upon price was the fair one. Maybe the seller would have eventually agreed to that. Maybe the seller was definitely going to send him the animal if he paid the elevated pricing. Maybe a lot of things could have happened, but there is no evidence of this.

To post someone as a Bad Guy on the BOI based on pretenses, assumptions or "maybe" is not what these threads are for. These threads are for confirmed Bad Guy dealings such as proven scammers. Changing your mind on a price does not make you a scammer. And if people really want to keep using car dealerships as an example, please think of the "ethics" or car salesmen or even the "ethics" of many doctors. They are unfair comparisons to be using in this situation.

This guy does not deserve a Bad Guy thread and I hope anyone that sees this in the future will actually read it and make an educated decision based upon the information provided.

Originally Posted by deborahbroadus

Ok, let me answer this from another perspective. In this example the price was agreed to and you gave me a time frame in which to expect the money. If I changed on you in this example, I would be worthy of a Bad Guy thread. Hence me wanting to see the answer regarding the heading of the last email.

Ok... found the info for ya from his first post.

[quote=original post]he offered me $165 shipped. the next morning he emailed me. he told me the he had been searching around and found that albino burms were around $250 or something. he then proceeded to tell me that he has to up the price to $210.

Originally Posted by Deb

Changing minds, last I heard, was not a crime, raising prices is not a crime..but in this instance, he picked a bad time to change his mind..does that mean he's a "bad guy" or "unethical" he may have felt that the OP was lowballing him when he found out how much the animals go for.

From the first post... buyer asked for 150... seller said no but will do 165... buyer agreed to 165. I cant see how that was lowballing.. the buyer agreed to the sellers higher price.

The seller then went and got greedy once he realized how much they were selling for elsewhere.

I just recently did a trade with steve it went smooth and im totally satisfied but i can say that yes steve is very un educated about reptiles all around.Im not saying what he did was ok because it wasnt but i wouldnt call him a bad guy he just has some learning to do give him some time and give him a break hes new to all of this!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
SHELBY

[quote=Southern Wolf;947279]Ok... found the info for ya from his first post.

Originally Posted by original post

he offered me $165 shipped. the next morning he emailed me. he told me the he had been searching around and found that albino burms were around $250 or something. he then proceeded to tell me that he has to up the price to $210.



From the first post... buyer asked for 150... seller said no but will do 165... buyer agreed to 165. I cant see how that was lowballing.. the buyer agreed to the sellers higher price.

The seller then went and got greedy once he realized how much they were selling for elsewhere.

THE NEXT MORNING.. my, how time flies.

I agree with ShadowAce..a lot of assumptions are being thrown around.

Diem ... I am not making assumptions... I am stating facts from previous threads right here on the BOI.

As to saving other folks... that also is NOT an assumption. It is as well fact right from these very own BOI threads. I have seen numerous times where someone was thinking about doing business with someone then decided against it because of their actions that was brought to light here.

But one BOI Thread does not dictate another. So, yes, for this seller, that is an assumption. You are saying because similiar threads have popped up in the past and those people, later on, have been proven to be "Bad Guys" means this thread is justified. No, it is not.

Originally Posted by deborahbroadus

THE NEXT MORNING.. my, how time flies.

I agree with ShadowAce..a lot of assumptions are being thrown around.

Ok... this will be an assumption... maybe the buyer had to transfer funds to his paypal account from his bank account.. and thus "the next morning"

I dont know.

What I do know is that I have made a deal for an animal while at work... then I had to work over... and didnt get the money transfered till the next day. In that case I did however notify the seller of the delay in payment.

Originally Posted by ShadowAceD

But one BOI Thread does not dictate another. So, yes, for this seller, that is an assumption. You are saying because similiar threads have popped up in the past and those people, later on, have been proven to be "Bad Guys" means this thread is justified. No, it is not.

The seller is free to come here and pleed his case.

From what I can see .... the seller set the price... the buyer agreed to it... and before the buyer could get him paid (less than 24 hours)... the seller jacked up the price.

I still fail to see how that warrants a Bad Guy Thread.

Originally Posted by ShadowAceD

I still fail to see how that warrants a Bad Guy Thread.

Lets say that I produce Sunglow boas next year and you decide to buy one from me for $300. We both agree to this price and I am the one that set this price. Then before you get a chance to pay me (less than 24 hrs later) I do some searching online and realize I priced him way too low and I contact you and tell you... I cant do $300 for him... He's too cheap... but I can sell him to you for $450. (which is prolly still cheap for a sunglow... )

How does this not make me a bad guy. We already had an agreed upon price that I set. You didnt haggle me down to $300... I set that price.

So with that in mind... punch holes in my logic. Im open to hear how Im wrong... you never know... you may change my mind.

Originally Posted by Southern Wolf

The seller is free to come here and pleed his case.

From what I can see .... the seller set the price... the buyer agreed to it... and before the buyer could get him paid (less than 24 hours)... the seller jacked up the price.