Would it be possible to use Fauna as a “trust” for trades?

I suppose there always has to be a wet blanket in the bunch, and I guess I'm it. Please don't take this the wrong way, as I like the majority of you folks very much, and I have done many trades and business transactions with a whole lot of people here. However, to put it frankly, my business dealings, trades or otherwise, are none of anyones business but other then myself and the person I'm dealing with. The idea of having my business dealings posted on a public forum bothers me a great deal. I do hope that on the chance that a person is doing a trade with another person on fauna, that you make sure you ask permission from both parties before one of the parties is allowed to post anything at all about the deal. My emails and phone calls are intended to be private dealings between myself and my counterpart, and would not be open for publication unless it was considered very warrented. I'm very pleased to have a pretty good standing here, and I have no intention of ever ripping anyone off. However, how I conduct my business, and what transpires between myself and whomever I'm dealing with is not anyone else business at all. I think that if you like this idea, go for it, sounds great if you like this sort of thing. Just make sure that you have a policy in place the excludes the people that don't want to participate please. Some sort of fauna version of the "no call list". Take care

Ken,
If I read the discussion correctly thus far, both parties have to agree and post in the thread. This would not work if only one party posted. I would agree that I may or anyone else might also want to keep dealings private.
In that case, don’t agree and there is no post.

Ken,

Though I understand what you are saying, having it made public could very well bring more business. Even with something like this implemented, there could be some who would be wary of going into a deal with a person who someone else hasn't already dealt with.

Originally Posted by Ken Foose

However, to put it frankly, my business dealings, trades or otherwise, are none of anyones business but other then myself and the person I'm dealing with. The idea of having my business dealings posted on a public forum bothers me a great deal.

Ken, my understanding is this program is to be voluntary to of course you are free to choose whether you wish to participate.
Out of curiousity, I looked at your recent posts and 100% of them are responses to posts in the BOI, so at some level I think you agree that public comment on private deal is OK; in fact Shelly posted about a deal she had with you and you thanked her for her comment.

However, to put it frankly, my business dealings, trades or otherwise, are none of anyones business but other then myself and the person I'm dealing with. The idea of having my business dealings posted on a public forum bothers me a great deal.

Ken,

The idea behind is to give people reassurance in a deal they are going to carry through. It’s perfectly understandable if anyone wants to maintain his deals private. But for example if someone wanted to do a breeding loan and did not feel comfortable without something in writing and witnesses to it, this would be the place to do it. Depending on how well it works people might get used to rely on it for most transactions and even request it as a guarantee. At least that’s the way I view it.
Regards.

Originally Posted by Ken Foose

My emails and phone calls are intended to be private dealings between myself and my counterpart, and would not be open for publication unless it was considered very warrented.

With all due respect Ken, this is a totally unreasonable expectation. Unless you have the other party sign a nondisclosure agreement, anything that you write or say to any other party (be it a business or a private individual) is not private and that person has every right to repeat it and publish it. The only exceptions would be if you gave information to a professional who was providing services to you (such as an attorney, accountant, physician, clergyman, etc.) where there is an implicit expectation of privacy.

Hence the BOI exists. If the details of all deals were expected to remain private, how could anyone ever post about good or bad experiences?

None of what I said changes the fact that you could choose not to participate in this program. Frankly, your reputation precedes you and I doubt that anyone would see the need. If they did, you could provide a list of 100 references. If they still were unsure, you probably aren't doing the deal anyway.

I can see Ken's point of this. Perhaps there is some trepidation that some people may consider this proposal as a REQUIREMENT of doing a trade where one party may not want to take part in it. Kind of like how sending photos of individual animals in a sale or trade at one time was a courtesy and lately has become a requirement for some people to even consider doing business. Sort of like the "Frankenstein Effect".

If past history has been any guide around here, 10 percent will love it, 10 percent will hate it, and the other 80 percent won't even know about it, or won't care one way or the other.

Now WHERE exactly should such a forum be located? If it is going to be open to all types of animal and hard good trades, it needs to be in a relevant section. So where do you prefer? Any consensus on a name? It doesn't have to be perfect, we can always change it later.

Originally Posted by WebSlave

Kind of like how sending photos of individual animals in a sale or trade at one time was a courtesy and lately has become a requirement for some people to even consider doing business.

Apples and oranges, Rich. The reason that pics have become "standard" is that the technology has become easily and cheaply available and so many people have broadband connections. When we used to have to take film pics and have them developed and printed (at an expense) and then scan them (and scanners were expensive) creating those uncompressed files that took forever to upload and download with those old 2800 baud dial up modems...you get the "picture".

Today, even a cheap digital camera can create jpeg images that compress well and upload/download in seconds.

Dan, excellent idea! With the amount of chicanery going on in the reptile industry, I think any safeguard is a good safeguard. The BOI gives people a chance to research before and comment after but this idea would really hold people to the trades that they agree too. Love it!

Jamie

I think you missed the point Jim. Someone producing 4,000 to 6,000 babies per year just doesn't have the time to send out individual photos to every Tom, Dick, and Harry who wants a photo of a $25 animal. Yet some people are coming to expect that sort of service because someone only producing 200 animals per year certainly does have that sort of time available. No lie, I have had people ask me to send them photos of every Motley corn I have so they could pick out the one they wanted. I declined their business. That is what some people are coming to expect these days, and it just is not a feasible way for everyone to do business. How many times have we seen people claim that they absolutely will not buy an animal that they cannot see photos of beforehand? Extrapolate this to people who may come to claim that they absolutely will not do a trade with someone who will not engage in this process being discussed here. This is the "Frankenstein" I mentioned earlier.

What Ken Foose may be bringing up as a point is that some people could be concerned that this process being discussed here could add another layer of complexity and additional time to a process that would be a burden upon them if REQUIRED by the other party. Having a sterling reputation does you absolutely no good at all if you are dealing with someone who doesn't have a clue about that reputation. So some newbie wanting to do a trade with Ken, and not knowing of his good reputation and insisting upon this public process may be turned off enough by Ken's refusal to take the time out of his busy schedule to participate, and he could therefore lose out on that trade because of it.

I believe that it is a plausible concern and needs to be considered.

Personally, I don't do trades myself, but if I did, I certainly would not have the time to become involved in some long drawn out process in order to do so. I do see the benefits of a project like this, but it obviously is not going to fit everyone. And if someone has an issue with it, I think it needs to be addressed and discussed just as much as the positive aspects of it.