underground reptiles no response

hi i bought a few ornate uro from rian 1 was under weight and 1 was in very bad shape i called him about it and and told him i dont think she will make it and he said if it die to e-mail a picture and he will take care of it i received the uro on tuesday afternoon and called him about the one that really concern me the most i e-mail him a picture on wednesday telling him it didnt make it as of today still no response i sent another e-mail to him and i will keep ever one up to date of the out come thanks for the time to post my views bruce

I thought you would like to see this thread.

http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/foru...threadid=30757

Best of luck,

Mike Durbin

Mike

Thanks for saveing me the time looking for the old link.

You know I have to wonder at this point if Rian should be dealing with uromastyx.

On a side note, this is exactly why kingsnake is wrong for not allowing posts like this on their forums. Im sure if this experience, and the previous one had both ben posted on the uro forums, maybe people would stop wasting money on Undergrounds uros.

But then again, hell its been a whole day, isnt it the buyers fault now? Guess I will have to wait for the "official responce" on another web page.

Mickey Hinkle
The Lizard King Reptiles

i called rian today and talk with him on the phone about the ornate that died he say he will send one out on wednesday so far he is doing excactly what he told me it nice to see somebody stand behind his word as far as the other one is doing fine and eating and gaining weight and looking alot better rian told me to soak him a few time a day and it working fine i know it hard to take a person word on the health of a animal but rian is doing just that hopefully it will be here on thursday i will like to thanks rian and undergrond reptiles for standing behind his animals and thinking about other as well that it for now i will post again on thursday with good new i hope bruce gaudet

While I think it is great that this transaction is being worked out to you satisfaction, in your first post you described one of the Uro's you received as, essentially, dying, while the other was skinny. I highly doubt you would have purchased them if they were represented as ill and underweight.

With that said, I do not think I would be so happy if I was being compensated for the loss of one of my purchases with another from the same "batch," so to speak. Do you know what killed the first animal?

While I think it is great that Rian is trying to work with you, Underground Reptiles would not have to "stand behind" their animals like this if they sent out healthy reptiles in the first place.

Regards,

Lauren Rost

something seems fishy about the story coming from the originator of this thread. Maybe I'm just biased against people that aren't adept at English.

Bruce

If you can will you post pics of the uros sent to you. Hopefully this will be plain enough english for people.

While I understand it looks very bad when someone cannot type/speak proper english (I do it myself often), however you cant really say they have no case due to that. I mean not everyone in this country is on the web or a computer all day. Many great people are unable to type to save their lives. Take my wife for example (please take her jk) she is well educated, speaks well, but cannot type to save her life. That being said she cares for our animals as well or likely better then I do.

I also agree with an earlier statement, a simple policy to live by....


Dont send out questionable animals.

Lets recap here, Rian sent out a egyptian uro that "must have been injured in shipping" that was never with another cagemate, but had scars that looked alot like either a uro that had been in battles, or worse an imported uro (when it was sold as cb).

Next he sends out two ornate uros, one half dead, and one skinny.

Who cares if he is now willing to work it out, it just seems too fishy at his choices of shipping out animals. I know S__T happens, and animals can and do slip through the cracks, however this is looking more and more like a pattern to me.

Again theese are just my opinions, and Bruce I do hope he works with you, but Id also get some kind of written health guaruntee on the remaining uro should you decide to keep them. And IF he offers a full refund, where you have to ship the other uro back, I would JUMP ON IT QUICK, but make him pay for the animals up front.(To be clear, Im not implying anything by that statement, just he made you pay upfront before shipping to you)

Mickey Hinkle
The Lizard King Reptiles

Hi,

I received a call from Rian today about the shipment of the ornate that died. He seems more worried about the post on BOI and me trying to ruin his business. I asked him why after 6 days and 2 e-mails I still had to call him to talk to him. I think I was more then fair when someone is trying to avoid you. If on the other hand, I would place an order would it have taken 6 days to get back to me? Well, anyway, Rian called me this afternoon to inform me that the Uro he has, the one he was holding for me and shipping out on Wed., that was fat and healthy (which I asked him when I spoke to him on the phone 2 days before is now too sick to ship. I wonder if I didn't post on the forum would he have shipped another sick uro? He said a friend called him and told him about the post, which I guess would might have saved another uro. It seems that it is no problem for him to refund my money on the dead uro. If he would have looked at the reptiles before shipping them, these things could be avoided.

I think it is time for people to start thinking about selling what they would like to receive. Maybe we can stop seeing so many reptiles needlessly perishing for no reason. I understand there is alot of stress in shipping, but most of the stress could be minimized if they start out with healthy animals. I also must say, some of the uro's were fat and healthy and took 3 days to get here. I can't see how one could change in 22 hours. The problem is the stress put on these animals when shipping. It is only escalated when there is a problem. This forum is the best for everyone. Buyers have a place to voice their opinion. Sellers have a place to do the same. One must understand that we must post good situations as well as bad. Maybe alot of these situations would be avoided. I would like to thank BOI for giving me the opportunity to voice my opinion.

I would also like to tell the person on one of the threads before that English and grammar have nothing to do with the care and upkeep of reptile. Also, to stick it in his hat and chew it ( Can you understand this?????????????????????????????

Bruce Gaudet

What is with some of you guys do you even know the situation? Or the person you are trashing.
Mikey Hinkel who are you to talk with your soul on your sleeve and your morals in your mouth? Do you know me? Did you try to? How do you say the things you do with such bad intentions? is this professional jelousy or are you just a bored kid whom noone taught any decency?

Bruce loved all 10 animals he recieved from 2 different orders then one broke down a few days later, sorry it happens to EVERYONE in this biz. The shame is the animals die but that is the facts of the matter and there is not a thing anyone has been able to do about it! Unless now that you have your animals noone else should have theirs!

It took 2 days to call him back after I got the Picture I took a few days off to be with my children during Christmas is that OK?

If the animals were so bad then why 2 orders???

Why because they looked great when he got them just like they looked great when they left here!

With Uros they do that because of the humidty levels in the different states and you can't fix them if they don't adjust that is just the way they are and if you don't agree then you don't know these are the facts not the opinion as some express with such velocity and vulgarity as well as venom.

Please stop this bashing of people you don't know the truth about there will come a time in this life or after that you must give an account for every idle word.

Sounds to me like Underground is likely just selling animals on the web, and then picking them up at the importers when the money arrives.

This practice is happening more and more and is one of the real causes of the problem. This is how it works (or often doesnt I should say) for anyone new to the herp trade.

Seller A advertises a animal on kingsnake. Often the animal is represented as either a pet, or a former "project" that intrest was lost in. Sometimes the seller will admit its just an animal purchased for resale, but often the story is more elaborate. The seller precides to tell the buyer they have the animal on hand, and it looks great, is feeding great, ect. They hook the buyer, and the money is sent. Once the money is in their hands they go to one of the many importers in Florida, and buy the animal that day. They never once cared for the animal, and often have not even seen the animal. I would even say some of them NEVER see the animal, as they send a flunky to do the leg work for them.

If you look at the above senario, that is why many un fit herps are sold. If you get a decent seller that works like the one decribed above, they may actually refund prior to shipping. But most would rather keep the cash and send a questionable animal then reveal the lie.

Im not against brokering animals, Ive done this myself for years. I even have and still rarely do purchase from importers myself. However its a far different game to buy from someone with the actual animal in their care, rather then someone who pre sells imports basically.

Now Im not sure this is what is happening here, but boy the shoe seems to fit. Maybe Rian would like to come here and defend himself and his business. Or will we again be re directed to his site to boost his ego and hit count? At this point I dont care if he refunds your money (not to sound harsh, I do hope you get it) I still find his business to be suspect to say the least. Finny thing is I have a sneaking feeling Ive met him before. In fact I am betting I know what vendor he was in Tampa. Anyone remeber what booth or round about what location he was at the most recent show.

If its who I suspect it was, I wouldnt buy from them if my life depended on it. It wasnt the worst table at the show, but it was in the contest. But then again after what Ive read, and the way it seems that underground conducts themselves, I wouldnt buy from them one way or the other (not that I think he would sell to me).

Im sure your reading this Rian, why not respond. Maybe you can enlighten me and the rest of the people following your threads. Maybe Im all wrong, I would love to eat crow if I am, but with only one side I am more and more convinced yours is the wrong side.


Mickey Hinkle
The Lizard King Reptiles