Adenovirus Document from University of Florida - Page 6 - FaunaClassifieds
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Old 04-23-2007, 11:44 AM   #51
draggintails
4/13/07 I was told that Dr. Jacobson was contacting other labs and more information on prevalence could be forthcoming. If he sends me this information I will post it here.

Testing the egg will be good to establish vertical transmission or environmental....so this will be a very good bit of information for us.
 
Old 04-23-2007, 03:15 PM   #52
ladyknite
As I read thru these posts, the certainty of one thing remains constant. Fear and worry.
We all hoped that the release of the letter from UF-Jacobson would reveal that the majority of the population in the US was not infected and that we stood a shot in the dark against this virus. Instead what we got seemed to be depressing, to say the least.

Without the facts in tact to support the letter such as the answers to Wendy’s questions…….HOW DO WE NOT ASSUME that the deck may have been stacked with positive dragons, all from the same area or that pressure was not applied to the university to produce answers before they were ready. Why was a controlled test not performed?

There is obviously some variation in this virus. We see dragons that falter and die unless they are maintained by us, we see dragons with issues on and off, dragons that are healthy and dragons that are classic FTT. What makes some die and others appear healthy? If it’s a mutated form of the virus…….isn’t that important to know? Or should we wait another bunch of years until they all have the same strain to try to answer those questions?

Now let’s look at a legal point of view.
Under most laws stated, if a merchant sells an animal that is sick or faltering, that said merchant can be held legally and financially responsible (state laws also apply). However a merchant is defined as someone that breeds according to his facility. Not the guy down the road that sells off a clutch or two. Seems to me that it then becomes a buyer beware law with the exception of the large scale breeders.

In reading what is posted throughout all of these discussions, one becomes vaguely aware that if the general census becomes that the adenovirus is prevalent in all colonies across the US, that people have no moral or obligatory issue from this point forward. Does anyone see CONVENIENCE written all over that?
 
Old 04-23-2007, 03:56 PM   #53
Drache613
Hello

Hello,

I agree, while it does look extremely depressing, it isn't going to help matters if everyone isn't going to come together & work to get this thing under control as much as possible.
It has to start at the larger scale breeders, because they are the ones who sell mass amounts throughout the country to the petstores, etc, & then the petstores distribute them.
Unfortunately, until some of those questions are answered, it makes it hard to know for sure of what is going on. I would hate to think that the results would be stacked. There have been reports of Adeno outside of florida so we know that Adenovirus is everywhere not just in florida.
I hope that more definitive testing measures come soon, for a more larger populations. This IS a start though.
Everyone needs to cooperate if it is going to improve.

Tracie
 
Old 04-23-2007, 05:50 PM   #54
walker75
Quote:
Originally Posted by ladyknite
As I read thru these posts, the certainty of one thing remains constant. Fear and worry.
We all hoped that the release of the letter from UF-Jacobson would reveal that the majority of the population in the US was not infected and that we stood a shot in the dark against this virus. Instead what we got seemed to be depressing, to say the least.

Without the facts in tact to support the letter such as the answers to Wendy’s questions…….HOW DO WE NOT ASSUME that the deck may have been stacked with positive dragons, all from the same area or that pressure was not applied to the university to produce answers before they were ready. Why was a controlled test not performed?

There is obviously some variation in this virus. We see dragons that falter and die unless they are maintained by us, we see dragons with issues on and off, dragons that are healthy and dragons that are classic FTT. What makes some die and others appear healthy? If it’s a mutated form of the virus…….isn’t that important to know? Or should we wait another bunch of years until they all have the same strain to try to answer those questions?

Now let’s look at a legal point of view.
Under most laws stated, if a merchant sells an animal that is sick or faltering, that said merchant can be held legally and financially responsible (state laws also apply). However a merchant is defined as someone that breeds according to his facility. Not the guy down the road that sells off a clutch or two. Seems to me that it then becomes a buyer beware law with the exception of the large scale breeders.

In reading what is posted throughout all of these discussions, one becomes vaguely aware that if the general census becomes that the adenovirus is prevalent in all colonies across the US, that people have no moral or obligatory issue from this point forward. Does anyone see CONVENIENCE written all over that?


With this post

From what I have seen on some breeder sites is that they are " now " incubating known positives eggs from positive dragons that have tested positive.

They are continuing the cycle futher with out regard and charging what more money for the morph that has Adenovirus

Which means to me they never had any desire to contain or control this Virus and wants the General Public to believe that this Virus is in all Colonies and Line in the US.

Thus confirming that they have and had knowing passed this Virus unto others with out there Consent nor Knowledge.

Why ?? Because we now TESTING TO Test for Adenovirus...

SO all who have been affected and no longer will breed

IS what forgotten about??? OH NO

We need Controlled studies with Real Solid Information

The Answer's to Wendy's questions would be a great start..

I believe people have been set up and sold healthy positives without their consent nor knowledge,

I would want a refund myself plus damages to my business and Cost..

That one positive animal Contaminated all the others in the colony.. then unknowing breed ... those sold and on and on

Until 2 BRAVE LADIES CAME FORWARD

This may be prevalent but we need better, harder facts ,real numbers real facts....

Other wise to me this kinda smells of being bought and paid for by big breeders...
 
Old 04-24-2007, 08:53 PM   #55
Drache613
Hello

Hello,

Well, very true!! The larger scale breeders don't want to test because they say it is incovenient & too costly for them! They have no regard for the animals or for the consumers.
No one is going to test especially if the larger scale breeders don't, there will always be some type of excuse. The virus will never be controlled. Who knows, maybe they maliciously decided to infect other colonies because they were jealous of some, I don't know. Or, they simply do not care.
Geez, do you really think that they would pay someone off? Do I even need to ask that question? What are you saying that the larger breeders are manipulating the system to make it look like they all have it or what? Sorry don't mean to sound so ignorant.
I knew they were still going to breed & incubate positive dragons, no doubt about that. Very sad.


Tracie
 
Old 04-26-2007, 01:22 PM   #56
Dachiu
It has taken me a few days to overcome my amazement of these last few posts. The insinuations that the University of FL. has in some way been pressured in any way or paid off to release information which is contrary to their own findings is absolutely, absurdly ridiculous - and you should be ashamed of suggesting such a thing.

The idea that any particular breeder or group of breeders would intentionally submit positive samples to ‘skew’ or ‘stack’ the results to favor a particular outcome - is another situation entirely. If this is truly what any of you believe, then you need to state exactly who those breeders are that you suspect of doing such a thing. This is a very serious accusation - so either put your cards on the table, people… or fold.

Moving on, if you believe with any conviction that what you suspect may be true… you need to pick up the phone and contact the University of Fl. directly for the answers you seek… and please post any facts that you may have been given.

These latest remarks positively indicate that a few of you believe the panel of researchers who put this paper together are altogether incompetent when it comes to analyzing the data they have complied over the years. You hint that Dr Jacobson and his team do not know the value of weighting actual test results against the sample sources and just haphazardly put this paper together to present to the public. I don’t believe you can be any more disrespectful than this.

But, if you are the least bit unsure of yourself and/or do not have the guts to contact and question the researchers on this issue then you need to pull up your panties and stop showing your ass on the forum -
then apologize for your behavior.
 
Old 04-26-2007, 01:36 PM   #57
varnyard
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dachiu
It has taken me a few days to overcome my amazement of these last few posts. The insinuations that the University of FL. has in some way been pressured in any way or paid off to release information which is contrary to their own findings is absolutely, absurdly ridiculous - and you should be ashamed of suggesting such a thing.

The idea that any particular breeder or group of breeders would intentionally submit positive samples to ‘skew’ or ‘stack’ the results to favor a particular outcome - is another situation entirely. If this is truly what any of you believe, then you need to state exactly who those breeders are that you suspect of doing such a thing. This is a very serious accusation - so either put your cards on the table, people… or fold.

Moving on, if you believe with any conviction that what you suspect may be true… you need to pick up the phone and contact the University of Fl. directly for the answers you seek… and please post any facts that you may have been given.

These latest remarks positively indicate that a few of you believe the panel of researchers who put this paper together are altogether incompetent when it comes to analyzing the data they have complied over the years. You hint that Dr Jacobson and his team do not know the value of weighting actual test results against the sample sources and just haphazardly put this paper together to present to the public. I don’t believe you can be any more disrespectful than this.

But, if you are the least bit unsure of yourself and/or do not have the guts to contact and question the researchers on this issue then you need to pull up your panties and stop showing your ass on the forum -
then apologize for your behavior.
Funny how you can say that Dachiu: absolutely, absurdly ridiculous indeed.

I think that was the same thing I told you not too long ago.

Quote:
Dachiu: so either put your cards on the table, people… or fold.
This is also a funny statment, looking back at you having some questions to answer yourself.
 
Old 04-26-2007, 03:35 PM   #58
varnyard
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Dachiu
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I wonder??
 
Old 04-26-2007, 03:46 PM   #59
mikey
Bobby, get over it !! You are still acting like a 5th grader at recess, you got involved with a subject with you had ZERO knowledge of and you ran with it. You have only yourself to blame for looking like a FOOL(Tool) you do now. You changed sides as often as a 5th grader changes best friends.
 
Old 04-26-2007, 03:49 PM   #60
varnyard
Quote:
Originally Posted by mikey
Bobby, get over it !! You are still acting like a 5th grader at recess, you got involved with a subject with you had ZERO knowledge of and you ran with it. You have only yourself to blame for looking like a FOOL(Tool) you do now. You changed sides as often as a 5th grader changes best friends.
I choose the truth, that what I support.

Yep, I think we all know who is behind this.

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Dachiu
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Last Activity: 04-26-2007 02:31 PM
Creating Private Message mikey @ 02:31 PM
 

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