Bobby Hill - Varnyard Herps: Buyers Beware.

Originally Posted by hhmoore

I think we can say that, regardless of any individual's prior opinion regarding whether (or not) Bobby was a Good Guy, "recent developments" make that descriptor unsuitable. It just doesn't fit anymore.

Very correct. I really, REALLY wonder what happened though.

I am an objective person by nature and generally try to see things from different perspectives. As a result, people misinterpret what I say frequently and think I am defending someone or being biased, etc. While we are all just speculating on what may or may not be going on in Bobby's life, I'll throw in a speculation as well.

I have a theory, but I hate to even say it because I really don't want to be part of the rumor mill. But having known Bobby for many years and the passion for his work, it seems that he sunk to very low place in his personal life and just couldn't get up. Whether you like him or not, agree with his actions or disagree, most people can't argue that he did have a passion for breeding tegus. To turn his back on what was once the highlight of his life shows something serious is going on. I would hate to see my worst enemy go through something like that. I guess I just have a hard time wishing evil on people. Don't get me wrong, I have great sympathy for those who lost money. And Bobby deserves all the consequences he has coming. But I'm certain the emotional pain he is in is heavier than any legal consequences he is facing.

I have been given a fair warning for my earlier post, and I agree with the warning as this forum does try to be objective and neutral, so I retract that statement and will relay only that which pertains to my dealings with him and those things I know from personal involvement in the matters.

Bobby Hill has been a moderator on numerous forums that I have posted on. I have caught Mr.Hill countless times passing off wild, uninformed conjecture as fact (often dangerously) and I would call him on it, presenting documented fact and informed opinion of professionals where possible. This would typically result in him usually resorting to strawman arguments and insults. When that didn't work, he'd then resort to attempting character assassination. When that didn't work, he'd ban me. In all my arguments with him, I cannot recall ever resorting to name calling, character assassination, and always tried evolving the debate by refuting what was said and presenting material to back it up (ie. sticking to the facts - although admittedly, I could be very condescending once he got off track). I know I'm not the only one he subjected to this, but beings as I don't know the whole names of others he did this to, I can't pass this on as anything other than third party, sorry.

While he was a favoured moderator on www.thetegu.com, he was a proponent of the blue tegu, often praising their merits (many false, and again tried denigrating me when I presented the facts as I knew them). When things soured between him and Rick Sisco (then owner of the aforementioned site), suddenly Mr.Hill became VERY outspoken on how awful blue tegus were. Interesting turn of events there. At this time, he also invited me to be a regular poster on his new site www.tegutalk.com in an attempt to sway favour away from Rick Sisco and his site (something that rather surprised me as I thought Mr. Hill genuinely disliked me - I continued posting on both sites as I don't play that game, and was quickly banned again).

In the end months of 2007, I was in contact with Mr. Hill on the phone (again as he tried wooing me to help in his attempt to undermine Rick Sisco), at which time he sometimes ranted about Mexicans and Blacks (those are only the neutral words he used, he used others that many find offensive and don't feel the need to put forth here). This was the last time I had any dealings with him. 2007 (and prior - my bad experiences with this man go back to 2003) is a bit more than 5 years ago - in other words predating his "recent" downfall.

In all this time, 2003 until last year, despite my leanings towards his honesty and intelligence, in any posts regarding his business and breeding practices, I have always tried to be objective and promoted him as a respectable breeder. Laurafl seems to be a regular reader of my posts and I'm sure she can vouch this claim. I feel bad in that perhaps my saying of "indeed, get a tegu from Bobby Hill as he's a respectable breeder" helped him, in small effort, scam people over the last few years.

As for "very" recent events:
http://www.livescience.com/29186-exo...s-florida.html
It appears that Mr. Hill abandoned his animals LAST YEAR. He has had plenty of time to prove his true nature, and indeed he has. Even hibernating animals need to be watched over.

Yes, I do follow your posts, Colin, and can vouch for your objectivity.

I have to say that I have never seen the nasty side of Bobby that has been shown to others. I believe it exists, I'm just grateful that I haven't seen it. I was also invited over to "his side" after the big forum split, but I don't play that game either. Bobby did like to have a blind following and I definitely don't play that game. I waited until he sold the forum to get active in it.

I think we just had a cordial relationship. I learned from him, I learned what I didn't want by watching him, and I disagreed quietly to avoid being blacklisted in the tegu community.

I have to agree with some of the other posts about Bobby being not such a "good guy" even back years ago on Rick's forum. He used to regurgitate all sorts of info with no real hands on practical knowledge.Then once he went from having never even produced any tegus to suddenly being the self proclaimed, "biggest tegu breeder in the world", he really got a self righteous sense of entitlement with his magical lines of "Varnyard" tegus. It was all a big scam IMHO. In any case, in my dealings with him, I too found him to be a racist hillbilly that cared nothing for the tegu community and was just looking to further himself and his wallet. All of this stuff going down now just enforces to me that my original assessment of him was dead on.

Originally Posted by EA7770

I have to agree with some of the other posts about Bobby being not such a "good guy" even back years ago on Rick's forum. He used to regurgitate all sorts of info with no real hands on practical knowledge.Then once he went from having never even produced any tegus to suddenly being the self proclaimed, "biggest tegu breeder in the world", he really got a self righteous sense of entitlement with his magical lines of "Varnyard" tegus. It was all a big scam IMHO. In any case, in my dealings with him, I too found him to be a racist hillbilly that cared nothing for the tegu community and was just looking to further himself and his wallet. All of this stuff going down now just enforces to me that my original assessment of him was dead on.

So you're saying bobby never produced tegus? Interesting.

I really like the part where you, YOU, as well as a few others, were just fine doing business with this ''racist hillbilly" (racist in itself) as long as you were getting what you wanted but now that he's a pariah you're piling on with all the rest who have no morals to speak of and will do business with ANYONE so long as they get what they want.

Your mamma must be so very proud of you.

Originally Posted by Wilomn

Interesting.

What I find "interesting," is how friendship dulls not only your killer instinct; but also your reading comprehension. EA's post clearly indicates what he feels was a quick progression from bobby never having bred anything; to bobby suddenly becoming the self-proclaimed master of all things tegu. There's nothing in there that says he hasn't currently produced anything. I can't vouch for whether or not the implied timeline is accurate, but I think that his meaning was clear, at least, to anyone whose ego doesn't get in the way of acknowledging that they've backed a dud.

Face it, you not only bought into the Varnyard hype, you're still apparently mesmerized by it. As it turns out, he's basically the Chris Johnson of tegus. I believe that they both carefully cultivated abrasive and overbearing online personas, apparently designed to instill trust in some; while intimidating others. For all we know, TSE was bobby's inspiration. If there are any sociological truths to be gleaned from online forums, I believe that one of them is that some people love an uncompromising personality; while others fear to tangle with one who wields it. An idea that many people have used to their own benefit. The argument could easily be made that both you and I fit into that category. Anyway, the only discernible difference between the two is that Chris Johnson at least sent his customers something, even if it wasn't the het they were expecting.

Also, unless Appalachian-American has officially be recognized as its own nationality, I think "hillbilly" is hardly racist. Possibly disparaging and vaguely bigoted; not even remotely racist. You're really grasping at straws, Wes. You have to realize by now that your friendship means nothing to bobby; so why be so willing to cling to that sunken ship? Is it really so hard for you to admit that you're wrong?

You question our morals, yet you're the one who - despite the occasional, half-hearted "bobby is in the wrong" - is the biggest supporter of the person who's ripped off quite a few people; as well as abandoning animals to slow death and cannibalism. He sure is a swell guy. I know that morality is a comparative and subjective concept, but your stance here may be making some people wonder which direction your own moral compass points. "Piling on" is only acceptable when the target isn't your buddy? "Interesting." I shudder to think of exactly what a friend of yours would have to do for you to condone their being piled-on and Kruse-ified, as you, yourself, have previously felt the need to publicly do to others.

Originally Posted by Wilomn

So you're saying bobby never produced tegus? Interesting.

I really like the part where you, YOU, as well as a few others, were just fine doing business with this ''racist hillbilly" (racist in itself) as long as you were getting what you wanted but now that he's a pariah you're piling on with all the rest who have no morals to speak of and will do business with ANYONE so long as they get what they want.

Your mamma must be so very proud of you.

No, I'm saying that he was full of crap prior to producing tegus. Then, once he actually DID produce some, he REALLY became full of crap (and ego). And to clarify, I NEVER purchased any animals from Mr. Hill. I was breeding tegus long before him and his magic Varnyard stock animals came about. But I certainly had many conversations with him. The majority of my animals came directly from Ron.

PS hillbillies are not a separate race (although that may be debatable LOL)

Bobby produced some beautiful tegus and i will say some of the best out there but he lacked 100% on the business side of things he had a great passion for these reptiles and i feel it is wrong to be dissing him.

Originally Posted by bfb345

Bobby produced some beautiful tegus and i will say some of the best out there but he lacked 100% on the business side of things he had a great passion for these reptiles and i feel it is wrong to be dissing him.

I have never had any dealing with Mr. Brown, but I do have a question for you. Do you also find it wrong that with all this passion you speak about to allegedly abandon a house full of animals to have them starve to death or escape and possibly destroy local ecosystems???

Remember, that one's past greatness does not negate the terrible that you do today.