beware paypals users

to make this short and sweet whilst i find out more details
here is what happened..
paypals sent out letters in regards to my verified account of a year stating i was using my own account fradulantly.
reversed charges going back to four months ago and has taken the funds back out of the sellers accounts to compensate them.
how ...why...what...im not really totally sure yet but its happening.
im working on finding out exactly what has happened and who is involved in it but that is the current state of affairs.
when i log onto my own account it shows the transactions as all completed still..so i have no way of knowing who is getting these notes except when someone writes me to tell me.
paypals claims its the banks fault..bank claims it papals fault..yada yada yada..
when i get more details ill report them here..so far all i can do is speculate on it and feel its not a smart idea to post here until i can prove what went wrong.

kim

I, too, have lost all faith in paypal!
And i was one of their biggest fans...i have used paypal for a couple years now, i have payed for items and received payments...never a problem.
Kim payed me by e-check....which cleared a few days later...that is all the way back at the end of october.....and now they are telling me that I have the amount she paid me charged back to my account.... and carry a negative amount on my paypal account, that i am liable for.
When i talked to a person at paypal, about how a thing like that can happen, since it was even a e-check that CLEARED...all they will say is basically......to bad, that can happen.
When i ask how they/I can resolve that.....again, "TO BAD, you can go get the buyer to fix it or call the cops."
Thats the gist of it.
I know Kim will fix this problem and i feel for her, having to sort out through all of this.
But i can't help but worry and wonder....what if this happens with OTHER transactions and OTHER buyers that i do not know (unlike Kim)?
Thankfully i haven't actually received but 2 payments on paypal in a long time....i use it mostly TO PAY OTHER PEOPLE with.
I thought it was safe, at least with e-check....i thought i was safe IF i transfer the money from paypal account into mine....(don't keep funds in paypal account)
But this is a rude awakening...
This is from the formerly biggest paypal fan.....
BEWARE!!!!!

let me get this straight....
paypal e-mailed the seller...told them something was wrong and took money out of their account.

Meanwhile they e-mailed the buyer.....told them something ws wrong....and took money out of their accounts too?

So if the seller sold a snake for $400
and the buyer bought said snake for $400
That is $800 that paypal is holding on to.

Did I get this right?
Or is this a completely different story and I just did not get it because of english being a second language.

Can someone explain? thanks

ritchie

i got an email saying something was wrong with almost no info.
i cant even answer this question right now fully because i dont know for sure.. what i do know is this..they emailed the seller four months later after the echecks had cleared and told them they wanted the money back..
thats what i know right now.

kim

Two words to help you find PayPal contact info and what your best course of action is!

http://www.PayPalSucks.com/

No I don't own this one but I'm not going to use PayPal anymore myself as I think Jeff Barringer may be running that too from the sound of things.

HONESTLY!! Check out the site as it should be a huge help!

Good luck Kim and keep us posted!

Adam Block

at paypal you are ONLY protected as a "SELLER" if all these points apply to the transaction...

Seller Protection Policy


General. PayPal agrees to indemnify sellers of physical goods from reversal liability resulting from a buyer's unauthorized use of a credit card and/or false claims of non-shipment of goods. This protection applies only to the sale of physical goods, and not to any non-tangible, non-physical goods or services pursuant to section 1 above. It applies to up to $5,000 per year of payments received by the seller through PayPal if the following conditions are met:


The seller has a U.S. Verified Business or a U.S. Verified Premier Account or a Canadian International - Verified Business or Canadian International - Verified Premier Account. Note: While International sellers outside of Canada may have a status of International - Verified, they do not qualify for and are not protected by the Seller Protection Policy and therefore may be responsible for any reversals made due to fraudulent funds


The seller ships to the buyer's Confirmed Address.


The seller can provide reasonable proof-of-shipment which can be tracked online. This documentation must show that you shipped to the Confirmed Address. (Most U.S. carrier companies offer this service, including the U.S. Postal Service.) For transactions $500 or more in value that are initiated between November 15, 2001 and April 19, 2002, and for transactions $250 or more in value that are initiated on or after April 19, 2002, the seller also needs to provide an online proof-of-receipt in the form of a signature from the recipient. Because comparable proof-of-shipment is not currently available for electronically-delivered items, we are currently unable to offer Seller Protection for digital goods and other electronically-delivered items.


The seller accepted a single payment from only one PayPal account for the purchase. (Multiple payments from different accounts for a single item are a fraud indicator. Sellers should not accept such payments.)


The seller ships to a domestic (U.S.) buyer at a U.S. address.


The seller cooperates in resolving disputes by responding in the following time periods: When a complaint occurs, the seller must provide complete information within 7 days of a request from PayPal. However, if PayPal is required by the credit card association to respond immediately to resolve a reversal, sellers must provide the information within 3 days. PayPal will indicate the response time required in the e-mail message sent to the seller.


The seller ships within 7 days of receiving payment.


So a little thing like SOMEONE ELSE then the actual buyer signing for the package....and you're screwed...if the adress is not "verified".....you're screwed.
If they say it has anything at all to do with their version of "fraud"...you're screwed.
i fear for all the people that have been stiffed in the thousands!!!

Fraud. Under no circumstances will PayPal reimburse requests in the event of fraud or misrepresentation by the buyer. In addition, fees will not be refundable in cases of fraud.

As Kim mentioned, paypal accuses her of having used the account fraudulently in some way. Which is a dispute between her bank and paypal. BUT since the word "fraud" is included.....I am not protected in any way.

and get this...

If you do not qualify for the Seller Protection Policy. When you receive funds through PayPal, if the sender's transaction is reversed for any reason and you do not qualify for the Seller Protection Policy for that transaction, you will owe PayPal for the amount of the reversed transaction plus any fees imposed on PayPal as a result of the reversal. You agree to reimburse PayPal from either your PayPal account or by other means as described in Section IV.2 under "Receipt of Payments."

meaning the seller better cough up that money or else....

This is the first time i went to the website PayPalSucks.com....the name itself always kept me away from it, as i thought it would be just a few complainers whining.....HOWEVER i finally visited it....and OYYY!!!!
What a eyeopener...
Like i said, I feel for Kim.....(((((((HUGS))))) girl!!!!!!!!
But SELLER beware....it CAN and most likely at some point WILL happen to you....and your buyer might not be willing to rectify the problem for one reason or other....you could be out of a lot of money and into a lot of problems....
Again, paypal worked GREAT for me for a long time, i was the biggest fan, loved it.
And i'm glad my eyes got opened that way.......and not another.
Sellers often think that if they opened bank accounts they ONLY have/use for paypal (to verify it with) they are safe.......they think that as long as e-checks CLEAR and as long as they pull the money out of the paypal account immediately....they are safe....
WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
AGAIN< BEWARE OF PAYPAL......read all the small print, read what can and has happend to other people.....
My god, just the thought of what scammers can do with all this....rather easily, too...

oh WOWW......and get THIS!!!!!!!

Specific item exclusions. Items or situations which fit any of the following exclusions are not eligible for protection under the Guarantee:

h. Animals, plants, or any parts thereof

of course there were many other things listed, but this applys for sales of live animals, thus...live reptiles!.... they also mentioned that as why its "to bad" for me...

the more i dig into it....sigh

I went through the same thing, I had a few charge backs this summer from credit cards. I down graded my acount so I cant accept them anymore and no longer leave a balance in the acount. It hits the acount and I move it to my g/f's right away and pull it out with the ATM card. When I called in to find out why I was being charged back they pretty much told me go screw myself. Because of Privacy policies they wouldnt tell me anything besides the credit card was used fraudulently also wouldnt tell what company issued the card so I could call them. I had no recourse what so ever. I spoke to several people and must have heard the words info and supeno in the same sentance 25 times. I had to go to Paypalsucks.com to find their phone numbers because they hide them so well within the website. I still use it but sometimes wonder if its worth the trouble, be carefull. I wish ya the best of luck Kim.

So does anyone have an alternative to offer? I have not been using PayPal all that long, but in the short period I have, I've heard more negative rumblings than I am comfortable with. Does Paypal being bought out by Ebay have anything to do with the bad press?

BTW, I will be moving this thread into the GBD forum shortly. It is more appropriate being there.

Dont qoute me but I dont think ebay bought out paypal, I think Paypal took over as their preferred payment option thats linked to all the ads. They used to use some another company called Billpoint they were a pain. I forget his last name but I found the link to paypal sucks from a guy named Dave in the boa forum. He had a lot of problems with paypal, he had a decent sized amount of money in the account and paypal locked it up on him and made him send in pay stubs and a copy of his social security card and a bunch of other stuff so they could verify who he was. He was already verified. Also I know of another guy that had Paypal linked to a checking acount and got charged back like $500 and they took it from his checking acount because the balance wasnt in his Paypal acount. I got two checking acounts one that is always empty or under $10 thats linked to my paypal acount and one I use normally. I am very limited in my use of it, more then anything I only take deposits through it.