4" Turtle Ban Lifted!

i was just wondering where everyone heard this info. I do work for a petstore, and we are not planning on jumping into this and sell thousands of sliders in plastic lagoons, but i was calling around to see if i could get a 100% yes on the sale of small turtles, everything im coming up with is a no.....the only thing i got is that it was introduced in feb. and never went any further. this is the website thomas.loc.gov and where it asks for the bill number its HR 924 so any new info would be greatly appreciated

I agree that it seemed very sudden, but I made some calls and the two agents I spoke to said that it was infact a real deal, but one said that it hadn't been put into action yet while the other one said that what I was told by my Turtle Farm buddy was legit. This doesn't surprise me that they all aren't on the same page, especially if you've been following all the crap that's going down in Texas.

I was notified of the pending vote by a fairly large dealer (who happens to be a friend). I did keep the links he sent for a few days, but I have since deleted them. Shouldn't be too hard to track down, if you are really interested.

Hopefully this link will work.

http://www.usnews.com/blogs/washingt...-petsmart-soon

Rick

Okay so I did a little searching today and here is what I have found. AS of now the bill has simply passed the senate. It now must be voted on by the House of Representatives, and then the president must sign it. How it did pass by a 93-1 vote, so I doubt the house would hold it up, and Bush is almost out so I doubt he cares. The ruling on changing the turtle law is actually an amendment to a bill that is trying to be passed to ensure better drug and medical device safety. Basically the Louisiana governer hid it in within a bill she knew would get passed. You have to love the way the law works.
Shane
www.sewerfest.com

That method of getting things passed seems to be a very popular way to work things.

Originally Posted by cahrens

I would have to think that the top 2 would be cats and dogs. Lot more of them in rescues(shelters) than any exotics.

In my experience, part of the reason for that is that most casual reptile owners who cannot quickly find a new home for it simply let it die via starvation or general neglect (I got a really nice PTS on the brink of death because the owner didn't want it and no one or no organization would take it so they just put it out in the garage and let it starve/dehydrate). And most people don't care. Kill a cat or dog and you face being ostracized or legally punished. Kill a snake, turtle, or lizard and you're a flippin' hero. Add to it, the few that try to find a rescue call their local Humane Society and are told that the animal will be euthanized as per their nationwide policy and in some case cost the $X to bring it in. Sothe rationalization becomes, "If it is going to die either way--why take the time and spend the money--just kill it with neglect." Some locales ignore this policy but by and large that is their recommendation as they are very oppposed to herp ownership because of my example above.

Originally Posted by Chadmann

In my experience, part of the reason for that is that most casual reptile owners who cannot quickly find a new home for it simply let it die via starvation or general neglect (I got a really nice PTS on the brink of death because the owner didn't want it and no one or no organization would take it so they just put it out in the garage and let it starve/dehydrate). And most people don't care. Kill a cat or dog and you face being ostracized or legally punished. Kill a snake, turtle, or lizard and you're a flippin' hero. Add to it, the few that try to find a rescue call their local Humane Society and are told that the animal will be euthanized as per their nationwide policy and in some case cost the $X to bring it in. Sothe rationalization becomes, "If it is going to die either way--why take the time and spend the money--just kill it with neglect." Some locales ignore this policy but by and large that is their recommendation as they are very oppposed to herp ownership because of my example above.

Back in March a USDA vet came to my house to inspect my ball pythons. She noticed a bin on top of the rack with some dirt/sand mixture, waterbowl, and hide. She asked what was in there because she couldn't find the animal. I asked her if she was allowed to give me any citations or to take any animals from me, and she said that she did not have th authority, she was merely there to check on my husbandry. I opened up my dresser drawer and pulled out a 1.5" Hermann's tortoise that I had placed in a deli cup right before she came. She knew exactly why I did it and she laughed and told me some interesting things: 1.) The buyer cannot be punished for buying a turtle/tortoise under 4"...it is illegal to sell them, not to buy or own them. and 2.) She said that they were working on a bill to overthrow the outdated law anyway. I'm happy to see that it's fairly close to being legit, because sometimes it can be a real hassle to purchase an animal you want.

On the flip side, it makes me a little sad because I know how cute the little turtles/tortoises can be, and many people see them for what they are at that time and don't realize that they can't live in a fishbowl their whole lives, they may die before the tortoise/turtle does, or that sometime there is no commercially made cage big enough for a full grown animal. I know I have seen hatchling sulcatta's and decided I wanted one, then I go, "wait! college...small apartment, no yard, big city...BAD idea!" and put it down. I REALLY wish people would research their animal BEFORE buying the cute little one they see. I also think that sellers should have a moral/ethic responsibility to say, "hey, it looks cute now but it will grow. These are the problems that are going to arise..."

Originally Posted by droogievesch

Back in March a USDA vet came to my house to inspect my ball pythons. She noticed a bin on top of the rack with some dirt/sand mixture, waterbowl, and hide. She asked what was in there because she couldn't find the animal. I asked her if she was allowed to give me any citations or to take any animals from me, and she said that she did not have th authority, she was merely there to check on my husbandry. I opened up my dresser drawer and pulled out a 1.5" Hermann's tortoise that I had placed in a deli cup right before she came. She knew exactly why I did it and she laughed and told me some interesting things: 1.) The buyer cannot be punished for buying a turtle/tortoise under 4"...it is illegal to sell them, not to buy or own them. and 2.) She said that they were working on a bill to overthrow the outdated law anyway. I'm happy to see that it's fairly close to being legit, because sometimes it can be a real hassle to purchase an animal you want.

On the flip side, it makes me a little sad because I know how cute the little turtles/tortoises can be, and many people see them for what they are at that time and don't realize that they can't live in a fishbowl their whole lives, they may die before the tortoise/turtle does, or that sometime there is no commercially made cage big enough for a full grown animal. I know I have seen hatchling sulcatta's and decided I wanted one, then I go, "wait! college...small apartment, no yard, big city...BAD idea!" and put it down. I REALLY wish people would research their animal BEFORE buying the cute little one they see. I also think that sellers should have a moral/ethic responsibility to say, "hey, it looks cute now but it will grow. These are the problems that are going to arise..."

I find it weird though that you would be allowed to buy an illegal animal but not sell an illegal animal. I think it is just plain illegal to even have possession of an object in an area where that object is not allowed, in this case banned livestock?

Anthony Allis
ExoticsExpress@aol.com