Perfect Predators (Manny Frade) - Scammer on Breeding Loan

Originally Posted by jben

one can only hope he man's up.

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I've dealt with this guy, wouldn't he have to a man to start with, he'll never man up.....

Again, the very best of luck Victor!

Lynn Peterson
Big Time Reptiles

Originally Posted by Big Time Reptiles

I've dealt with this guy, wouldn't he have to a man to start with, he'll never man up.....

Again, the very best of luck Victor!

Lynn Peterson
Big Time Reptiles

Lynn -

Thank you very much, and no he won't. He was given the opportunity to resolve the issue and told me he would only "give me credit." When I told him what I wanted he responded with "what you want is well over the initial value of these (2) VPI females" ($5K in 2011). Funny how he is worried about HIS animal value when I'm not even accounting for the interest lost for 6-years. He refuses to rectify the issue and I find it AMAZING that he is still in business.

Mr. Frade has all the time in the world to post the animals he has for sale for the upcoming HAMM show on the Facebook forums but NO TIME to come to the Fauna and resolve this obvious scam.

He is a disgraceful individual.

Vic Martino

Originally Posted by Martino Reptiles

He is a disgraceful individual.

I agree. What i don't understand is how people continue to buy from him........ I guess people will learn the hard way and unfortunately we will continue to see new BOI post on Manny.

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Originally Posted by jben

I agree. What i don't understand is how people continue to buy from him........ I guess people will learn the hard way and unfortunately we will continue to see new BOI post on Manny.

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In retrospect the BOI has saved me more times than I've posted about bad people. And as inconvenient as it is - it's a mild set back compared to the positive feedback received from good breeders, support from colleagues empathizing due to their own experiences with Perfect Predators and the animals I continue to work with. This year was one of my biggest years acquiring new stock from Chi-Town Constrictors, Lucas Matlock, Mike@ Basically Boas, Tony Hawkins of 2nd Alarm Reptiles, Chaz@ Low Key Boas, Richard Ceniceros and plethora of other top breeders, all of which provided the best animals and service.

With some luck - more people will do a simple internet search and find the information they need to make an informed decision about this individual. Knowing he would never make right on this (namely because my animals have long been sold because he can't produce photos of the adults), I wanted to share this experience. Afterall he did tell me to "start now" [inferring he didn't care one way or another if I told people what happened].

Vic

Does anyone know if it is possible to stop Manny Frade and his company from participating in reptile shows? I know Victor mentioned that that is where he first met him. It may slow down some business ties that he will try to gain if a reptile show representative was contacted and showed evidence. I would not recommend this without damning evidence because there are a lot of people out there that like to spread rumors, but with everything discussed thus far, it is irrefutable.

Originally Posted by Aimee_Manson

Does anyone know if it is possible to stop Manny Frade and his company from participating in reptile shows? I know Victor mentioned that that is where he first met him. It may slow down some business ties that he will try to gain if a reptile show representative was contacted and showed evidence. I would not recommend this without damning evidence because there are a lot of people out there that like to spread rumors, but with everything discussed thus far, it is irrefutable.

I also wanted to add that this is definitely not a complete fix to your situation, Victor, and I am very sorry for the business transaction that occurred with Manny Frade. I was just thinking of other ways that, as a community, we can be effective in snuffing out some profits that he may get. Also, reporting his group to Facebook with evidence and showing he is fraudulent will get the group/page shut down pretty easily. Just a thought. Smoke him out, and good luck with anything that happens in the future!

Originally Posted by Aimee_Manson

It may slow down some business ties that he will try to gain if a reptile show representative was contacted and showed evidence.

At this point, I'm fairly confident that everyone knows just what Manny Frade is all about. I've often found that, for every situation that actually makes it to the BOI, there are quite a few more that are making the rounds in the background. Word of mouth tends to get around pretty well in niche markets. If promoters were inclined to turn his business away, I doubt that they'd really need anyone to petition them to do so; there's already more than enough public info available to justify permanently blacklisting the guy. When there's the potential for profit, many people are eager to roll the dice, as his continued business has long shown. Wouldn't want the bottom line to be impacted by taking the moral high ground.

Originally Posted by Fangthane

At this point, I'm fairly confident that everyone knows just what Manny Frade is all about. I've often found that, for every situation that actually makes it to the BOI, there are quite a few more that are making the rounds in the background. Word of mouth tends to get around pretty well in niche markets. If promoters were inclined to turn his business away, I doubt that they'd really need anyone to petition them to do so; there's already more than enough public info available to justify permanently blacklisting the guy. When there's the potential for profit, many people are eager to roll the dice, as his continued business has long shown. Wouldn't want the bottom line to be impacted by taking the moral high ground.

I totally agree with you there. I had heard of him before this, I had no idea he was still screwing people over. I wish everyone was on Fauna, but I understand why people divert away from here due to controversial and heated arguments (this thread is very nice though). It would be nice to make a blacklist that could be posted on a prominent reptile forum or website, but it is hard to determine who the real scammers are, because people like to make up BS about others!

Originally Posted by Fangthane

When there's the potential for profit, many people are eager to roll the dice, as his continued business has long shown. Wouldn't want the bottom line to be impacted by taking the moral high ground.

Nailed it.

Although there are still a few places on the internet where this behavior would never be tolerated, the fact remains that many places (to include most of the usual advertising sites) will turn a blind eye to con-artists in the same of lining their pockets or reptile bins. It's the reality of it - and certainly nothing new to the industry. I've been around since the late 80s and have seen some truly disgusting practices. What I can say however is THIS site is truly the exception provided facts are properly presented (as it should be).

Vic

Originally Posted by Aimee_Manson

I understand why people divert away from here due to controversial and heated arguments (this thread is very nice though).

I don't. I can't even begin to relate to the mindset required for someone to be afraid of words on a monitor. As you noted in another thread, even the strife often serves a great purpose. Based on much of what I've seen, I'm more of the opinion that the people who actively avoid this forum may be doing so because they just don't like the idea of a venue where even the most incriminating information can't be made to conveniently disappear.

Originally Posted by Aimee_Manson

but it is hard to determine who the real scammers are, because people like to make up BS about others!

That's where solid evidence comes into play. Sure, people can and do sometimes make up false claims on here; but much more often than not, they're pretty vigorously exposed. Like so many other things in life, one shouldn't be quick to accept anything on here that doesn't come with proof, or at least stand up to logic.