Underground Reptiles: Sick animal inquiry?

Sorry about your snake. If you want more detailed testing you can submit a sample here https://vetmed.iastate.edu/vdl/diagnostic-tests for $25. I would call them and tell them exactly what you are looking for. You can have your other animals tested as well at $10 each.

Will, testing for the spores? I don't think I'd be comfortable with an at home biopsy! Regardless of the results, I think perhaps as a community we are bit naive about receiving WC snakes (or those housed with them) from affected regions. Time to be vigilant and QT for an extremely long period of time in the case where exposure is likely.

Originally Posted by Lucille

This is a strange progression of illness.

Only if you don't know what your talking about.

Originally Posted by KNOBTAIL

I think it would be wise to remind those who are involved in this thread that there are those out there who would love to stop , find health issues to curtail or make it more difficult to have any herps . Not to mention the transportation across state lines. Especially when it comes to health issues. what better reason could there be if someone's fear moved into people getting affected.

Its interesting how, if one comes on the BOI to talk about someone who sold them a herp, they better have every drop of hard evidence. But if someone wants to post innuendo, denigrating, insinuation about someone who posts here they are totally free to do so with no facts, no evidence, nothing.

Curious, no?

Wow. You should consider suing whoever taught you reading comprehension in grade school. No one, ever, said Underground shouldn't be shipping animals. As has been stated repeatedly, this post was to inform people that snakes shipped from Underground may be infected (in my opinion and that of my vet) and that we need feedback from anyone who has bought snakes from them regarding the health of the animals purchased.

The rest of that stuff you just made up in your head guy.

Maybe you can get your hands on some breathing salts?

Originally Posted by MCMB Reptiles

In my opinion, the OP did not approach this situation/thread with nearly as much tact as you are describing. What this BOI thread portrays is an epidemic of unlimited consequence to the point that people are alerting fish and wildlife and stating that underground shouldn't be shipping any animals at all.

Where is the basis for this? The fact that there exists a very rare, largely unstudied disease that shows similar symptoms? The fact that wild caught animals (which are known for carrying parasites and diseases and have a much shorter life expectancy than captive bred animals) became sick under one person's ownership (and improved when he improved his husbandry, I might add)? That is incredibly irresponsible and could end up having very drastic consequences as far as owning and shipping reptiles are concerned, as was mentioned by another member.

You're willing to risk the ability to buy and sell any animals across state lines, or own them at all for that matter, because there's a rare disease out there and you saw a couple snakes with blisters from bad husbandry? As intelligent as you generally come across, I must say that I'm absolutely in shock. This thread should never have existed until definitive proof was provided that showed there was something to worry about.

Originally Posted by MCMB Reptiles

To me this thread is spreading fear with absolutely no grounds for doing so. If the test results come back showing that it's SFD, by all means, make a thread and alert people. So far there is ZERO evidence that it is other than that one person in a facebook group said it might be. That is NOT grounds for causing panic.

Nobody is spreading fear or causing panic, you twit. (Can I say twit on here?)
I am just asking for others experience - looking for evidence if its out there. I have made no accusations what so ever. If you happen to be panicked, or peed yourself a little, thats your problem.

Why is it that people cant read the facts - I bought snakes from Underground, they developed what MIGHT be SFD, has anyone else had problems like this? - and not jump to: "OMG UNDERGROUND HAS HORRIBLY INFECTED SNAKES!!!"

Please, stop making me restate this. I'm begging ya.

Originally Posted by thamnophis123

Its interesting how, if one comes on the BOI to talk about someone who sold them a herp, they better have every drop of hard evidence. But if someone wants to post innuendo, denigrating, insinuation about someone who posts here they are totally free to do so with no facts, no evidence, nothing.

Curious, no?

I don't believe KNOBTAIL was referring to you or anyone who has posted on this BOI. When I read the statement, "those out there who would love to stop , find health issues to curtail or make it more difficult to have any herps . Not to mention the transportation across state lines", I understood "those out there" to mean more like, govt. agencies, animal rights nuts, non-participants of the actual BOI thread etc.

I could be wrong, but I didn't see any personal dig at you, but rather a concern with things "get(ting) out of hand as it will surely lead to someone somewhere notifying authorities". Just my personal observation.

You are 100% correct Robert. I misread his post. Worse, I failed to respond to the very pertinent questions he asked in regards to "what if?"

How do we respond responsibly to this disease if its found in dealers, wholesalers, pet stores? What about captive collections? Some associate it only with cool, wet/damp conditions but it has been diagnosed in tropical, dry conditions too. It can turn up anywhere apparently.

What if, is our next hurdle.

Originally Posted by Robert Walker

I don't believe KNOBTAIL was referring to you or anyone who has posted on this BOI. When I read the statement, "those out there who would love to stop , find health issues to curtail or make it more difficult to have any herps . Not to mention the transportation across state lines", I understood "those out there" to mean more like, govt. agencies, animal rights nuts, non-participants of the actual BOI thread etc.

I could be wrong, but I didn't see any personal dig at you, but rather a concern with things "get(ting) out of hand as it will surely lead to someone somewhere notifying authorities". Just my personal observation.

Some aspects of the disease, if the moderators will allow it -

Many aspects of testing for this disease are peculiar. The cultures are overwhelmed by bacteria, for example. And biopsies often miss the disease because they don't lie directly under the skin lesion. So your local vet probably isn't going to be able to diagnose with out help from Dr Allender at U of IL.

The infection of this fungus (O.o.) can be almost superficial, like the skin blisters we see on snakes kept in damp conditions, or snakes emerging from hibernation. But in some cases the fungus goes sub-dermal. It can get into bones and muscle. When it does, it cant be shed off. The sheds remove the outer problem, but the fungus grows from within the snake regardless of the dry / warm conditions the snake is kept in.

The initial symptoms are very much like the little white pustules showing on Logan's N. taxispilota pics upstream in this thread.

There is no known cure, but keeping the animal warm and dry can help.

That would have been useful in the thread created to capture that topic that was kindly created by another member so that there would be a reduction in distraction from Underground Reptiles and what pertains to that company (such as any claims or evidence for or against them). The thread on the disease which may be at play here exists and instructions have been given to post about the disease in that thread unless it is going to involve Underground Reptiles more directly. Also, asking if you can call a person a twit after calling a person a twit is probably not the most wise means of discovering the answer, but sometimes wisdom is a deficient resource.