Scammed by Andrew Michael Popp Las Vegas, NV

Chris, I am a little confused.

The first screen shot you posted, you initially reached out on 12/23, and Andrew did not reply until the 27th just saying, "are you still interested, this guy is getting weird on me"?

Also, the jump from "Yes, I'm Chris Davis, take my money!" to "The website is SYR..." that is where you guys talked on the phone, and you are just summarizing your phone convo?

Originally Posted by DavidBeard

One thing that seems to be rather apparent: Chris Davis has a knack for running into unusually bad deals involving Turtles and online purchases. One would think (logically) that he would either A-be more selective/careful with his decisions on who to deal with or B-forego online purchases altogether giving his track record.

I find it odd that he continues to do business with scammers or unknown people.

I buy a lot of turtles, so that increases my chances of running in to a dirtbag. But also I'm a naturally trusting person, and yes that probably gets the best of me

Originally Posted by Mike (The M)

Chris, I am a little confused.

The first screen shot you posted, you initially reached out on 12/23, and Andrew did not reply until the 27th just saying, "are you still interested, this guy is getting weird on me"?

Also, the jump from "Yes, I'm Chris Davis, take my money!" to "The website is SYR..." that is where you guys talked on the phone, and you are just summarizing your phone convo?

It was half phone and half text - so that's how the conversation looks

Originally Posted by Mike (The M)

Chris, I am a little confused.

The first screen shot you posted, you initially reached out on 12/23, and Andrew did not reply until the 27th just saying, "are you still interested, this guy is getting weird on me"?

Also, the jump from "Yes, I'm Chris Davis, take my money!" to "The website is SYR..." that is where you guys talked on the phone, and you are just summarizing your phone convo?

Also, it was not "take my money" he signed a contract, he gave three good references, and Mike Fedzen had done business with him before. And he used his employer for credibility, the turtles came from Jimmy Whitt who owns like six stores. Excuse me for not expecting every single person in the reptile biz to be a low down dirty F*** crook!

Originally Posted by calebroad

Also, it was not "take my money" he signed a contract, he gave three good references, and Mike Fedzen had done business with him before. And he used his employer for credibility, the turtles came from Jimmy Whitt who owns like six stores. Excuse me for not expecting every single person in the reptile biz to be a low down dirty F*** crook!

Yes, I read it. It wasn't a criticism, it was levity. Lighten up. You don't need to respond to or answer every argument you feel you're invited to, especially when replies that aren't relevant to the facts or moving resolution forward make the thread more convoluted.

Eventually you're going to figure it out for yourself Chris, but unfortunately a good portion of the captive herp community actually ARE morally/ethically questionable. I've learned this myself over the past 20+ years in dealing with reptiles.

A few points here. I hope that the pics that you have to identify the animals are bigger than they appear on here as it isn't that easy to do so based on the size of the pics from the ad in the Summer. A judge may accept expert testimony from the parties that you have mentioned since they are experts in the field but to the untrained eye it maybe tougher to tell especially with that size of pics. The onus will be on you to prove that he was dishonest in the deal since you are the one bringing on the action. I am not a lawyer but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night

I do not see him admitting that he lied, etc. was that done in text or email or on the phone? If it's not in text or email and was done verbally it will be tough/virtually impossible for you to prove what you said that he told you. If it's in black and white then there is no doubt that he did as you've said that he did and he's in trouble if he doesn't right this.

I too have been scammed but in a non chelonian deal, the best thing that you can do is learn from it and try to recover what you can out of it. Do not make the same mistakes again. If you are a trusting person, reserve that trust for those that have earned it and try to be more cautious for your own financial protection.

Originally Posted by Bryan S

A few points here. I hope that the pics that you have to identify the animals are bigger than they appear on here as it isn't that easy to do so based on the size of the pics from the ad in the Summer. A judge may accept expert testimony from the parties that you have mentioned since they are experts in the field but to the untrained eye it maybe tougher to tell especially with that size of pics. The onus will be on you to prove that he was dishonest in the deal since you are the one bringing on the action. I am not a lawyer but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night

I do not see him admitting that he lied, etc. was that done in text or email or on the phone? If it's not in text or email and was done verbally it will be tough/virtually impossible for you to prove what you said that he told you. If it's in black and white then there is no doubt that he did as you've said that he did and he's in trouble if he doesn't right this.

I too have been scammed but in a non chelonian deal, the best thing that you can do is learn from it and try to recover what you can out of it. Do not make the same mistakes again. If you are a trusting person, reserve that trust for those that have earned it and try to be more cautious for your own financial protection.

So, yes you have brought up some very good points here, he sent me an actual contract, that stated if they do not prove out het for snow or caramel, then he will refund the $6,000 plus $1,000.00 for keeping expenses. But the problem with that is, that I cant sue under that contract until they hatch some eggs, maybe a year or two.

Now, he did state on his text messages, that he guarantees my satisfaction or my money back - so of all the complexity, those few simple words may be the ones the judge hears the loudest. And those few words could save the day.

Okay, so also, the package arrived two hours late, so this slimy scammer even got a refund from UPS - lol - I mean, I guess stealing the $6,000 was not enough to satisfy that greedy itch.

Please see the text message screen shot attached, where he agrees, to my confirmation about "adults" - I can show the judge these are not adults, not even close. I will find a reptile expert in Vegas to come to court and testify about that when the time comes. So, your absolutely right, a lot of my evidence will go right out the window. However, I do have some hard core evidence, enough to show without a doubt that Andrew Popp is a lying crook.

Okay, so lets say I lose? - I will wait until they hatch out, and then I will sue again, and this time I will have a black and white signed contract to nail him with.

Also, since his shot Scales N Tails are involved, they are being sued also, and I am speaking with the DA about criminal charges. -

Okay Okay, so the your thinking the DA is not gonna do crap right? - Well that may be the case, but who wants to chance that.

What if the DA feels for me, and issues felony warrants? - And Andrew Popp is not likely to be given a bonus from his boss for getting them all sued, unless, like I suspect, they are all in the theft ring. They came from the owner and were sold by a saleman of Scales N Tails (Andrew Popp)

Anyway, its a lot of risk, I really truly believe that Scales N Tails and Andrew Popp will think long and hard, before they scam the next guy. - Im never gonna stop, Im gonna sue and sue until they make me stop. And im leaving reviews on BBB and everywhere else about Scales N tails involvement.

Also, get this, Andrew Popp sends me an email the other night and says I have crossed a line, and that he is gonna get me for lible and slander>>> HAHAHAHA - Bring it on you little lying, cheating, scammer!

Originally Posted by DavidBeard

Eventually you're going to figure it out for yourself Chris, but unfortunately a good portion of the captive herp community actually ARE morally/ethically questionable. I've learned this myself over the past 20+ years in dealing with reptiles.

It would probably earn me an infraction if I asked everyone to boycott Scales N Tails - and to let Andrew Popp know that scams in the reptile industry are frowned upon - and to let Scales N Tails know that their support and participation of Scam or fraud is not welcome.

So I won't asked everyone to do that for me

Originally Posted by calebroad

Also, since his shot Scales N Tails are involved, they are being sued also, and I am speaking with the DA about criminal charges. -

This is not a criminal case. There was a contract for turtles, you got turtles, but they are not what was bargained for. At most you are owed the difference between what was promised and what was received. I am not unsympathetic, and your posting of the turtle sizes was well done. It does appear that the turtles are smaller than advertised.

Originally Posted by Lucille

I'm waiting on your proof, but it is difficult to see how they have any liability at this point. Andrew may be their employee but he did not seem to be acting within the scope of his employment when this transaction was made. And as far as their name used for credibility, again I'm waiting on proof but if Andrew used their name, that is not their fault. If prior to the transaction they guaranteed the deal that is different, but the initial transaction seems to be between you and Andrew.
I'm sure all will be clearer once you post your proofs.

You've posted your proofs and in them, I continue to see no wrongdoing so far by Scales N Tails. At one time they had the turtles, but at the time of the transaction Popp had them. Popp works there, but the sale was not done within the scope of his employment. Scales N Tails seem innocent of wrongdoing yet you continue to threaten them.

Originally Posted by calebroad

Im gonna sue and sue until they make me stop. And im leaving reviews on BBB and everywhere else about Scales N tails involvement.

I think you are making a lot of loud threats. The problem is, is that you have used the very same method in your other past transactions that haven't gone so well and you've done squat. From your last dispute:

Originally Posted by calebroad

I am flying to Miami Dade in mid November. I am going to provided everything to a superior court judge. They might laugh me out of the courtroom. But may they may not, and if they issue the warrants for felony theft by deception, I absolutely vow not to drop the charges, under any circumstances. No matter what.