Calling all indigo keepers...

Hello all (Jeff, Tony, Doug, et al.)

We (the biology department of a small liberal arts college) are ready to start developing our techniques to look at genetic variation in the captive indigo population.

we have isolated the DNA from my four easterns using their shed skins, have amplified a host of suspected microsattelite regions and are now in the process of ordering specific sequence probes. (so, no, i don't know if mine are diverse or related yet) this process will take a few months because we have only a few students doing the lab work.

at this point we are interested in getting a few good, clean pieces of shed from your animals. this is going to be the preliminary work to see if we can detect variability. i would like to get a few non-couperi to throw in the mix as a way detecting couperi-specific alleles.

if you are interested in being a part of this project, here's what we'd like you to do. send us a freshly shed piece of clean skin (no fecal matter, handle as little as possible) in a ziplock plastic bag. we only need a small section of skin, so send 3-4 inches from the midbody. label this bag with a code if you send more than one sample. i only ask that you tell us the species.

i am not interested in anything more than looking at the genetic variation of the captive population. i understand that our findings may be controversial and may be perceived by some as potentially business-threatening. therefore, all identity of specimens and keepers of specimens will be held confidential. any published information will be coded (e.g. snake Dc-015) so as to keep the origin of the sample identity-free. we will acknowledge those who have sent us samples in the paper only if you give us permission to use your name -- but again, your name will NOT be associated with any individual specimens. Nor will any of this information be provided to any other individual or agency. If you don't trust our system, then anonymous specimens will be accepted as well.

here is a chance to mesh the academic and herpetoculture communities!

i'll answer any questions you may have by email: mrand@carleton.edu

send clean skin samples to:

Matt Rand
Department of Biology
Carleton College
Northfield, MN 55057


thanks! i'm very interested to see the response we get.

matt

It is good to see this project finally getting off the ground, as the genetics group here got a bit turned off by the lack of cooperation among the Pituophis community, whenever I requested genetic material for a similar project involving P. ruthveni.
I will be happy to provide genetic material and would just like to add, it is best if those also submitting material use tweezers and forceps to handle the material to be submitted and not their hands.

Best regards,

Jeff

How was the move from the warm and sunny climate of CA to cold and dismal climate of MN? ;0)
My mother-in-law, who lives in Minneapolis, told me you guys had several days of triple digit temps, so I suppose it wasn't all that bad up there, unless you prefer the cold over the heat.
I will have to look you up the next time we head up there for a visit.

Hope all is going well for you,

Jeff

i posted the same message that leads this string on KS.com. and it got yanked! god forbid we want to do some conservation or genetics.

again, a note to tell what they didn't like about the post would be polite.

matt


p.s. jeff -- the move went well, all 20-something tortoises, dozen snakes, two dogs, kid, and pregnant wife made it just fine. you're welcome to stop by when you get WAY up here.

I placed a post on KS regarding the Gopher Torrtoise Council and their Upland Snake Conservation Initiative, which is focusing on the Eastern Indigo, but they yanked it too.
I guess ole Jeff B. is so worried about filling his coffers with $$ he cannot stand to think of $$ flowing to a conservation effort. I do have to wonder though, why on earth they would yank a post calling for genetic material? Perhaps he believes the funds we would spend on postage would better serve his checking account. I for one, am sorry to see this and quite sick of the KS forum moderators. On a good note, it is nice to see several more folks posting here!

Glad to hear the move went well, Matt! That was quite a load you hauled up there and I will certainly give you a heads up the next time I am up there with my wife visiting her family...

Best regards,

Jeff

so far. it looks as if we're going to get skin samples from about six individuals so far. i'd like to see a better response. especially from those with multiple animals. and don't forget, we're also interested in acquiring skin samples from non-couperi Drys as well.

thanks for looking,

matt

Matt,
Blessings be unto you my brother! It's damned well time! You have my full cooperation and support. Get back to me with the specific address to send in skin to, and I will start with next shed.

Will you be willing to release/share information of those who consent to those who would want it? All of us may like to know a bit more of who has what. Anyway, good job! And thank you! This could be the start of getting a clearer picture of our captive gene pool. Something which is sorely lacking.
T.
T.

You should have a sample from the Uni shortly as we discussed. i am expecting her to shed today or tomorrow.

hi tony,

information will be returned to those individuals who want the info regarding their own samples. it will be up to those individuals to make their information public, or send it out privately. some individuals are sending their samples anonymously, so it will be impossible to match genetics with individuals.

for ethical considerations, i must adhere to this protocol. i want to get the largest sample for a good estimate of variation. hence, i will attempt to make this as close to a scientific sampling as possible. it will be up to the various participants as to whether they will divulge the details of our findings, if conclusive.

i would like to keep this as far from business and federal interests as possible.

matt

I am glad to hear that you are moving forward with this and I will gladly send you samples from my pair as soon as they shed again!

Eric