Ben Siegel Troubles

No pass for me. His arrest records show he has a cocaine possession charge as well.

Personally, I can never do business with them again. I live nearby and purchase all my supplies there, but that has ended.

My brother is schizophrenic and I have helped him as a caregiver, so I know a bit about disorders. It's not a free pass to be mentally ill, sorry.

I can't help but imagine if I had sold him a few geckos like I planned, and they were suddenly projectiles.

I personally hope he is banned from animals for good.

Originally Posted by rosebud945

So what does become of the animals in the store and the customers who have outstanding orders right now? Do we have any info on these issues?

The store is running fine. I was there last weekend and it was as good as usual. They have excellent staff working there.

If he choose to stop taking his meds and not go to therapy,lock him up!! He needs help.

He knew exactly what would happen if this stopped taking his meds,like we all know what happens when we stop taking our meds. Hes not a young kid,seems to be a bit intelligent,yet he's not to bright if he stopped taking his meds! Or keeping up with the proper dosing. And deserves what he gets.

Lock him up in the nut house if he won't take his meds and keeps hurting animals,people. If most of you seen a guy acting like that on the streets,you'd say the same thing!! But because it's "Ben" it's all different.

He's shown he cannot be trusted to do what's right. I hope he gets what he should,time away to heal himself again.

Someone said great staff. But yet they just watched him do what he did without stepping up? Why? Great staff would have done something other than video tape or whatever. That's not great staff IMO. Maybe good workers,but great?

I agree that he should not be around animals, and that might be for good now that his mental illness has this added component, ie, losing touch with his compassion toward animals.

However, as I mentioned earlier, Bi polar disorder is an extremely difficult and sad thing to deal with for the person suffering from it and the people around that person. I have experienced it in a family member and in someone that I worked with. There are times when they understand that they need their meds. During these rational moments, they feel terrible about the way they have behaved and they will stay on the meds for awhile, but two things are true: the meds make you feel terrible physically, they make you forgetful, and they can have the ironic effect of making you depressed or flat emotionally. The two people that I know who have it took the meds, apologized to everyone that he and she hurt during episodes, got sick of the meds or forgot to take them, and went off. Treatment for bi polar disorder is far from ideal. Its not like sobering up and staying on a wagon. Neither of those people are in my life now. I can't deal with the episodes, but I can't despise them. They are sick!

Please understand that mental illness is by definition a tenuous hold on reality. I don't know Ben. I see his good guy threads here, but I have never done business with him. I was horrified when I heard about this. I did not know about the mental illness until these discussions were started. Yes, I feel outraged at ANY animal abuse, and my first inclination is to despise the abuser. However, I also hope that I am evolved enough to understand mitigating circumstances. While I hope he either voluntarily gets out of the reptile business or is made to, I also feel compassion for a man with mental illness and for the people who make the difficult choice of staying by his side.

I don't think he has lost his compassion for animals. As I've said before, I'm betting that he was experiencing a psychotic break. Ben has been in this business for longer than just about anyone posting on this thread and has done some amazing things in the hobby. He didn't develop this disorder overnight. It's obvious he can hold himself together in the correct circumstances. What needs to happen is to get him stabilized and then go from there. Reading a lot of the posts on this thread makes me realize that the American public is still back in the 80's as far as understanding of mental illness. It's a sad thing, honestly. Rosebud, you are right in that the medical treatment for bipolar is not a miracle cure. People with this disorder need the support of professionals and also those in their personal lives. But, with the correct support, people can go on to do pretty much anything that someone without the disorder can do, as Ben has proven in the past.

Depending upon your reptiles of choice, you may or may not know that the same week as Ben's arrest, another prominent, well-liked member of this community lost his teenage son due to mental issues. Not one single person has put forth anything but sympathy and prayers. Not one person has suggested that, had he not stopped taking his meds, he would be alive. I haven't seen any "you should've known" or "why the past free passes?" As yet, no one has compared him to mass murderers like Lanza and Holmes. Our hearts break for this man, and his child. Yes, the child had plenty of 'instances' in his past. Does the difference lie in the involvement of the bearded dragon? God, I hope not.

Originally Posted by rcarichter

Depending upon your reptiles of choice, you may or may not know that the same week as Ben's arrest, another prominent, well-liked member of this community lost his teenage son due to mental issues. Not one single person has put forth anything but sympathy and prayers. Not one person has suggested that, had he not stopped taking his meds, he would be alive. I haven't seen any "you should've known" or "why the past free passes?" As yet, no one has compared him to mass murderers like Lanza and Holmes. Our hearts break for this man, and his child. Yes, the child had plenty of 'instances' in his past. Does the difference lie in the involvement of the bearded dragon? God, I hope not.

And some who consider this other person who lost his child to the same mental illness a friend are expressing compassion toward Ben, myself included. Having someone in your life who is bi polar is heartbreaking.

So let me ask this: for those of you who argue that no compassion should be shown to Ben, and who suggest that he is only getting compassion because he is Ben Siegel: on what are you basing that conviction? I have seen lots of good guy threads here. I don't have time to go and search for the dirt on him, so maybe you can enlighten me. I know that there was some domestic trouble last year that seems to be related to the mental illness, but is there a past case of mistreatment of animals?

The term should never have been changed from “manic-depression”. Every time I hear "bi-polar",I think of the north and south poles.

Originally Posted by Guy Castro

The term should never have been changed from “manic-depression”. Every time I hear "bi-polar",I think of the north and south poles.

Yes, I agree. If you have someone who is manic/depressive in your life, this is really what it is like. They will be extremely arrogant, angry, pseudo inspired, or obsessive ( and of course irrational) in one moment of time, then tumble to the depths of despair (irrational) in others.

I hope treatments have improved enough that there is hope for Ben to recover to the point where he can safely interact with animals again, but I haven't seen evidence that people with bi polar disorder ever stay on track indefinitely. One guy that I worked with is a brilliant guitar player. He will be the first to tell you that he is mentally ill, yet he is homeless. He drifts from one friend to another, burning bridges as he goes because he thinks he can't play when he takes the meds, so he tries to self medicate with alcohol, and of course ends up on the street again when he has that inevitable episode. This guy is past middle age, and this has been going on for most of his adult life.

It is incredibly sad to me when someone who has made such great contributions to the hobby, to music, to technology, to whatever, develops this disorder. Would you be more compassionate if he had schizophrenia, or a brain tumor that made him forget that he had a live animal in his hand?

Originally Posted by LizardKing777

No pass for me. His arrest records show he has a cocaine possession charge as well.

Personally, I can never do business with them again. I live nearby and purchase all my supplies there, but that has ended.

My brother is schizophrenic and I have helped him as a caregiver, so I know a bit about disorders. It's not a free pass to be mentally ill, sorry.

I can't help but imagine if I had sold him a few geckos like I planned, and they were suddenly projectiles.

I personally hope he is banned from animals for good.

You apparently don't have much exp. with disorders if you think he knew what he was doing.