Bad Guy Evan Stahl - Sent Me Sick Pine Snakes - FaunaClassifieds
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Old 11-01-2017, 10:18 AM   #1
Evan Stahl - Sent Me Sick Pine Snakes

I purchased 2 baby albino southern pinesnakes from Evan Stahl Reptiles and received them on August the 24th. Both ate small meals a week after arrival and then were fed weekly after that. On 9/7 the male regurgitated its meal, held down its meal on 9/14, then died on 9/19.

I notified Evan Stahl on the 19th and did not get a response until the 21st. The response basically said none of his other customers were having issues and that I should administer Flagyl.

The female then regurgitated its meal on the 24th and from there forward has kept down all meals. I assumed it was going to be ok as it seemed to be eating normally. I hoped for the best.

The female is now lethargic and while it is holding down meals it's poop is a bit runny and grayish. I notified Evan of this issue and he was very confrontational and basically told me it was my fault for not administering Flagyl. I insisted that he should have not sold me sick animals in the first place and let him know that I was very dissatisfied with the purchase. That is where I left things with him.

I have now administered flagyl after my not so great discussion with him on the 18th of October and am not seeing any difference in the female specimen.

I wanted to post my experience with Evan Stahl Reptiles since his reviews are turned off on his facebook business page and I would also like any suggestions you may have for getting this girl back on track.
Old 11-01-2017, 10:41 AM   #2
Flagyl is for intestinal parasites, are the snakes wild caught?
Have you taken the remaining snake to the vet?
Old 11-01-2017, 10:48 AM   #4
I should have done more homework first
Old 11-04-2017, 06:19 PM   #5
Chris Kennard
Originally Posted by cbaker81 View Post
I should have done more homework first
Yes. You've been on this site for over ten years? Homework is important. Over ten years on this site and surely more years of experience with reptiles than you introduction to Fauna, I would think that your homework would have saved a snake no matter what homework you did here.
Old 11-01-2017, 12:09 PM   #6
What was the dose of Flagyl you used ? Current recommended dose is 45-50 mgs / kg. Years ago it was much higher. Did you use liquid or dissolved a tablet ? Some say repeat it in two weeks while some say three days in a row.

Keep the meals very small and infrequent until she's back on track. And definately keep her away from your other animals.

Good luck.
Old 11-01-2017, 12:48 PM   #7
Did you have a necropsy done on the male? Have you taken the female to the vet?
Old 11-01-2017, 01:19 PM   #8
Just so you know, it is important to fast a snake for 3-4 weeks after a regurge, and then give small meals and gradually build back up to a normal prey size. Without this waiting period, the regurge will happen again and again, sometimes leading to death. As some of the others have stated, flagyl is for internal parasites, something a captive snake should never have. I can only assume that your albino animals are captive bred, so the only way they could have intestinal parasites is if they contracted them from another animal, which shows poor quarantine and cross-contamination, poor husbandry. Take your remaining snake to the vet immediately and have them test for parasites. If parasites are found, Mr. Stahl may be seriously in the wrong. But I have to ask, do you own any WC animals, and what do you do to prevent cross-contamination? It's important to know these things to rule out a husbandry error on your end. I will say that you probably should have taken these guys to the vet sooner. It's inappropriate to administer flagyl to a CB animal without a fecal test to confirm parasites.
Old 11-01-2017, 01:43 PM   #9
Originally Posted by elena View Post
Just so you know, it is important to fast a snake for 3-4 weeks after a regurge, and then give small meals and gradually build back up to a normal prey size. Without this waiting period, the regurge will happen again and again, sometimes leading to death.
I agree with this, for the most part. Two weeks is usually sufficient, especially if the snake is already ailing.

OP, before administering any further medication, I advise a vet visit for a check up and fecal exam.
Old 11-01-2017, 04:19 PM   #10
A quick recap of the facts. The buyer received the snakes and confirmed that he was happy with them 3 weeks later he informed me of problems he had and that the male haddied. I inquired as to why he had not contacted me sooner. He also has never sent me any pics or evidence that the male died.

I responded less than two days later. Apparently that is a long time as he keeps emphasizing that point. I was busy. Not everyone can respond 24 hours a day 7 days a week i do the best that i can.

So i then suggested that he dose the female with flagy. It is not only for internal parasites. It has very commonly been used to help with colubrid snakes that have digestive issues as it flushes out the digestive system and stimulates appetite. It is even used for humans.

I then did not hear back from him for a month. In that timw he not only did not take my advice but did not take it to a vet, have a culture done or anything else. His idea was after a snake regurgitate it should then be fed every dew days. No concern for the stress on the animal.

These are captive bred. You do not see too many wild caught hatchling albinos around. They were produced by an excellent breeder and were fed by him multiple times. I then held them here and they ate weekly on frozen thawed fuzzy mice for almost two months before i sold them. I never had any problems with them. From the same group animals were sold to several other customers who have also not had any issues.

I tried to help the customer with husbandry but got little and spotty information from him and answers to my questions. As i said when i did suggest what to do i got an argument and then he did nothing for the animal for over a month. Now that he took my advice the snake is eating and not puking.

A note on posting those negative links about me, instead of being selective to bash me why don't you post links to all the positive threads on me? I also have perfect trader rTings on this site with repeat customers. Trying to paint me in a negative way using those bad guy threads is just a weak tactic when every week i have dozens of happy customers who do not know this site exists.

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