getting " envenomated " can get you ........

Well Harold that is a good question. if their not all N.A. crotalids than all other species should be properly named commen and latan. As far as antivenin goes wow, well that would be fairly hard to give him/her the proper AV for a exotixc species, if the person is not able to identify the snake. So my best guess would to have an envenomation packet for every species of hot they own. And grab it when they get nailed. We dont have a venom one here, so the person would have to hope that their local zoo carried that AV for the species, if they could even identify it.

In your conception of this permit system, is a keeper required to provide a head count, or just a species list? Is there a fee? What is it based on (is it a one time payment, annual or other recurring payment; is it a flat rate, per species, per animal)? Will there be inspections? If so, who is responsible for performing them. Where will the salary for these people come from (uhoh, the permit fee just went up, lol). Will there be restrictions on the species that can be kept? Educational/experience requirements? Where will prospective candidates turn for there education/experience? Does it have to be from an approved source? The list goes on, but that should give you a good starting point

Originally Posted by shavemycoinpurse

So you haven't really done any concrete research - yet you are proclaiming the need for legislation in Pennsylvania?

Let's assume that your figures for envenomations in captivity are correct at 2. The U.S. Census bureau reports the population of Pennsylvania at 12,406,292 as of 2004. That would mean (according to your figures) that .00000161 % of the population of Pennsylvania were envenomated by a venomous reptile over the past 5 years.

So Vinny based upon the numbers, you should also champion legislation banning the following activities:

Odds of injury from fireworks: 19,556 to 1

Odds of injury from shaving: 6,585 to 1

Odds of injury from using a chain saw: 4,464 to 1

Odds of injury from mowing the lawn: 3,623 to 1

Odds of fatally slipping in bath or shower: 2,232 to 1

Odds of drowning in a bathtub: 685,000 to 1

Chance of dying from a car accident: 1 in 18,585 Better outlaw cars

Chance of dying from any kind of fall: 1 in 20,666 Ban stairs, ladders

Chance of dying from accidental drowning: 1 in 79,065 OMG - drain all lakes, pools and ponds

you are 1005 correct. i just want a permit system for keepers, just so people cant go just buy a hot to be cool. thats it. and i would like to talk to you and harald in person at Hamburg

Originally Posted by Vinny D

Well Harold that is a good question. if their not all N.A. crotalids than all other species should be properly named commen and latan.

No, all species, even NA crotalids should be properly labeled with common and scientific names.

Originally Posted by Vinny D

So my best guess would to have an envenomation packet for every species of hot they own.

I'm unclear about YOUR definition of an envenomation packet...but I'll address it as if you mean a starting dose of antivenom. And just what private party could afford to maintain a store of antivenom for exotics (Crofab would be out of range for many people - given the per vial cost, the recommended starting dose, and the shelf life). Then, who is going to administer the antivenom? Most hospitals that aren't in "snakebite territory" haven't got a clue, and the antivenom can be deadly...especially when wielded by an inexperienced provider.

Originally Posted by Vinny D

the person would have to hope that their local zoo carried that AV for the species, if they could even identify it.

again, more often than not, that won't be the case. A lot of zoos don't even have venomous reptiles, so there would be no antivenom...and not everybody has a zoo within even a few hours drive.

keep trying

If, by envenomation packet, you meant envenomation plan...you're correct - every keeper should have one. But what do you propose for that plan? Would everybody be required to have one? would specific information be required? A standardized form, perhaps? who would approve it? who would be responsible for the accuracy of the information? (I see dollar signs again)

Originally Posted by shavemycoinpurse

Odds of injury from using a chain saw: 4,464 to 1

Been there once Myself.................

That's a bite from one of your Boas dude! LOL

Looks painful but could have been worse.

Originally Posted by crotalusadamanteus

Been there once Myself.................

That'll buff out.

Originally Posted by Tim Cole

Looks painful but could have been worse.

LOL actually, it didn't hurt till the next day. And it almost was worse. I nicked the tendon that holds the patella in place, and the muscle next to it.

UGHH!! Chainsaw sharp!

Originally Posted by Vinny D

Well im sorry for trying to make the keepers of venomous reptiles a little safer. by having all venomous reptiles on record.

Just to be clear: you're NOT making the lives of RESPONSIBLE venomous keepers safer. You're trying to put up some obstacles which will stop Joe Sixpack and his cousin Ronnie Mullet from doing a "y'all watch this!" and removing themselves from the gene pool.

Responsible hot keepers, like responsible keepers of large constrictors or crocodilians, are already taking (well-established, tried and proven) steps to protect themselves and others from their animals. You aren't doing them any favors by presenting yourself as the poster child for Stupid Venomous Reptile Tricks.