Inquiry on Golden Serpents...aka Jewell Howard

Well Seamus, I guess now it is official..

In case anyone skipped over Seamus's post let me some it up for you. He admittedly said he's biased in the favor of Jewell & Neil (even though he hasn't done any business with either) So we're back to making it look like Sean's the bad guy here. I have question for any of you. Did Sean have proof of what made him wonder & inquire in the first place? I thought so! I have never dealt with either but with the way they attacked Sean after a simple inquiry I wasn't going to let him get verbally asaulted. Im sure many other people feel the same way they are just afraid to say it because they are worried about finding themselves under the same attack. Neil you think Sean owes you an apology? Oh yeah I forgot it's his fault you had the same snakes for $120.00 more in ad. If nothing was done wrong to begin with then you should not have any reason to get defensive.

After reading this thread I was so convinced that Neil G. was such a terrible business person with such bad professional ethics that I purchased a trio of TORTOISES from him this morning and don't feel at all bad about it.

As far as me being part of the BOI clique, all you have to do is check my history of comments. If anything I usually have given Neil a kick every once in a while when he got overly condemning.

Thanks Neil and I'll be looking for them Tuesday.

Mel.... Thanks, buddy.... they'll go out tomorrow!

And Chris.... BITE ME!

....Neil

I haven't purchased from Jewell, but I have delt with her while I was making a purchase from Neil. Neil wasn't in the shop and Jewell was the one Neil told me to call. Jewell was very nice and helpful. She listened to me and didn't make me feel "stupid" while I was describing the animal I wanted. I wouldn't hesitate to purchase an animal from Jewell. I think she's honest and "I like her attitude". I have purchase animals from Neil on two seperate occasions. I was very happy with my purchases. Hey Neil, the frogs are doing "GREAT". I would very happily purchase from Neil again(I like his attitude too). Yeah, I paid about 6 to 8 dollars more than I would have from a wholesaler, but it was worth it. I got the "exact" animals I wanted!!!!!

As far as the original post on this thread from Sean........ Well, to me it looked like he was trying to implicate that Jewell and Neil were trying to do some sort of a shady deal.

I also hope this thread hasn't scared off potential buyers for the snakes in question. The way I see it both Jewell and Neil "both" posted the same snakes for sale, because they were trying to sell them faster. They were both trying to help out someone who couldn't keep them, because of ill health. It seems that point has been totally lost in this thread. Some people only feel comfortable buying from an established shop. It's understood that there's overhead and the price would be higher. Jewell isn't that well known, at least to some people, but her prices are lower. It's all a matter of what each individual is more comfortable with.

I realize the my opinion doesn't matter, but I felt the need to put my .02 in.

It really amazes me how far out of control this thread has become. Much like Chris Pearson, I believe the original poster did not post with any malicious intent.

I think the real story here is the manner in which Jewell and Neil have "jumped on" anyone who had the audacity to even remotely question their actions or intentions.

I think the quote below sums it all up.

Neil, I would have thought that this type of behavior would have been left behind back at the 5th grade playground.

To everyone else, my apologies for perpetuating this thread.

Originally posted by Neil Gubitz - The Snake Pit
Mel.... Thanks, buddy.... they'll go out tomorrow!

And Chris.... BITE ME!

....Neil

Right then... I'll just put this here so nobody has to skip back to the first page to read it...

So Neil is selling the SAME snakes for $549 shipped while Jewell is selling them for $429 shipped. I am a bit confused since Jewell is selling the SAME snakes for $120 less. And the snakes supposedly belonged to a "J. MENDENHALL". A bit weird that the SAME snakes are being offered by two different sellers at different prices.

The use of capitalization to emphasize the fact that the snakes are identical isn't needed but people respond to strong language, the emphasis of the term implies that it's more important than it actually is and gives an impression that there is something exceptional and noteable about the fact. While not in and of itself a directly negative impression, when coupled with a few of the other messages inherent in the text it certainly does add emotional impact to the average reader...

The manner in which he says that he's confused... I suppose he might be a bit confused, if I had seen two ads by the exact same poster where the price went up the day after it might make me scratch my head a bit too, but beyond conveying what may be a truthful lack of understanding for the situation, it carries a strong overtone that he is confused about the entire situation along with the individuals involved, the very name of the thread "Inquiry on Golden Serpents...aka Jewell Howard" further helps to boister the impression that he was, until he saw the ads in question, unaware of Jewell's very existance. Rather than contacting the individual as one would tend to do if truely confused or simply creating a feasable possibility as an explination for the situation, he instead chose to create a post wherein he implied that there was something ethically wrong with the ads in question and yes, an attempt to put a slight patina of suspicion on the individuals in question. Even if he had been totally unaware of the connection between these two there are many, far more viable explinations avaliable than wrongdoing on anyone's part... since the ads were a day apart and both parties are in the same area, mabye Neil had bought them at the original price and was reselling them... maybe Mr. Mendenhall had contacted multiple people about brokering the animals... maybe they really were seperate animals that just happened to have similar descriptions... (I didn't get to see either of the original ads, were there identical pictures?) Really now, if you describe an animal just by age, gender, size and who it was produced by, then there are sometimes hundreds or even thousands of animals fitting the same description... Would anyone think something was really wrong if two people were both selling one year old trember line albino leo gecko pairs for seperate prices? Since Sean was aware of the buisness relationship there are still numerous possible explinations that should have come to mind first, perhaps one ad was a typo or they had discussed the price after the initial ad was placed and had worked out a more profitable but still quite reasonable price... And maybe, just maybe someone without a nasty suspicious vindictive manipulative mind wouldn't have even noticed.

The word "supposedly" before Mister Mendenhall's name and the quotations placed around it strongly imply that there is a suspicion that either tha animals didn't come from him or that he doesn't exist to begin with, again, the wording, while not directly accusatory gives an enormous impression that there is something shady, illegal or immoral going on here when that is not the case in the least.

The entire post, while not overtly accusatory is obviously a fairly poorly worded attempt to convey an emotion and cause an identical emotion in the reader while leaving the writer free from any direct blame for his words. Had he done it better or with more care, it wouldn't have been as obvious that he was trying to do so but this fairly crummy attempt at a subliminal communication of an emotional response is easily seen as what it is. If it hadn't been this crude, it might have been more effective too but as it stands, the only people who were swayed by it are those not quite bright enough to see through it.

If Sean still wishes to maintain that it was an entirely innocent posting despite it's fairly obvious nature, let him do so.

The only difficulty in that and the continuingly mounting evidence that shows it to be contrary to the case... Is the fact that he hasn't and won't apologize for the misimpression (which he claims is the case) given to those who read it. Anyone who was honestly making an innocent inquiry because they were interested in doing buisness would immediately have responded with profuse and sincere apologies for the mistake. That didn't happen and I'd wager it won't ever happen... That leaves only one option, that the post was in no way innocent, that the wording and the impression it gave were deliberate and that Sean, for whatever reason, was attempting to cast dispersions on the character of those who he wrote about. He can't have it both ways, either it was innocent and he apologizes, or it was deliberate and he admits it and maybe tells everyone why he felt it was needed to write what he did in the manner in which it was written.

Getting off that topic just a bit... Casey, I'm not real sure what you meant by that, I'm not taking any offense, it's just early and I'm a bit slow right now.

Neil, I would have thought that this type of behavior would have been left behind back at the 5th grade playground

I personally do agree with Mike on that call, I'm not certain that it's really appropriate to respond to critisism with out and out insults... I've told Neil that before though as well as many others, the person most able to damage your credibility is You, responses like that don't help matters any, quite the opposite.

There's much pseudoreasoning to be had on both sides of this one. Chris, Neil, et al, perhaps you should take a breather from this thread in order to collect your thoughts, as it has become nothing more than a back and forth exchange of ad hominem and other rhetorical devices. Neither side is presenting a persuasive argument at this point.

Discretion, as the saying goes, is the better part of valor.

Ken,
Is that really the case or are you just embarrassed for Neil ( I know I am) seeming how he's been reduced down to two word name calling? I see Neil got one customer out of the over 2,000 that read this post. Id be curious on a poll of how many after seeing the true colors come through would actually want to deal with either of them. You people sit back & watch Sean get bullied here without saying a word. Next time it could be you getting attacked for an inquiry. Think about it!