getting " envenomated " can get you ........

And about the banning of venomous reptiles in some states. Right now me my mom and the curator at the zoo, are trying to get a bill pased, so that people cant just go to a show, with no venomous reptile experience at all. And buy a death adder or something.

But wasnt this you? You went out and got a snake and then acted stupid and got bit, twice!

and other post from Vinny, I feel like I'm at a Alcohol recovery session where i did it but don't you do it ! LOL ~with all respects Vinny, I do not see it as to you or your mother or the so called curator job of trying to work on legislation or agendas of such as to your past incidents.

OK, so you are saying that it's a bad idea for people who are NOT at all experienced with venomous reptiles, to be able to go to a, lets say Hamburg,Pa show. And get a venomous snake. i think it's you people that need to open some eyes and see that TRUE reptile hobbiest and/or professionals in their feild want people to have to volenteer at a zoo to get proper training. "i have grew up." You guys think that people needing to have a permit to keep venomous reptiles, is a bad thing well thats BULL. Because i know many herpetologists who think it is a awsome idea. Not to stop people from being able to keep venomous animals, but for all keepers to have ALL hots on record for the state and/or hospitals. Some people here in pa do not keep any kind of bite treatment information. Rember im from Florida, I grew up with the legislation involving reptiles, and it just expired a couple of months ago. So i guess that Dr. Bryan Fry or Brint Spencer and hundreds of other reptile experts think it a great idea, for the safty of hobbiests and reptiles a like. Im not a bad guy. i have grown up ALOUT. So if you honestly think that is such a horrible idea in the world of herpetology, well than i dont know what to say. And i know exactly what you all mean about this may ban hot's period, BUT their is alout of people including me "in the past", who didnt have the PROPER training with venomous reptiles who have them right now. Do you understand what i am saying? i just talked to a 13 year old kid in Ohio who just got a monocle cobra "NO LIE" i tryed to tell him, But this is what im trying to say. Im ALL ABOUT SAFTY in hot keeping now. Before it was just fun I WILL ADMIT THAT, but no more fun. I study and work with reptiles because i love them. i dont want people to not be able to keep venomous reptiles as long as they are experienced. And a permit will help out alout with that and you know it. Im not your worst enemy at all. So please stop saying that.

OLDGUY, it has NOTHING AT ALL TO DO WITH MY ENVENOMATIONS, it is for the safty for hot keepers and thats it. Why do you think Florida's venomous leg, works so great. You dont thing it's a good idea????????

Originally Posted by shavemycoinpurse

Vinny and his mom are poster children for legislation/regulation.

They need the government to protect them due to their lack of the ability to make intelligent, informed decisions. And if Vinny and his mom can't negotiate daily life without guidance from the government, how could anyone else?

Its people like the Dragos that suck the teet of the government raw and empower politicians to protect us all.

It has nothing to do with that what so ever. like i said it is just for the people who are not experienced, and go to a show and buy a cobra to be cool. floridas laws are great. i can see that you DO NOT HAVE the respect for the safty of proper hot husbandry if you do not agree with a venomous permit system for keepers. it has nothing to do with being a POSTER boy!!

For the record, I don't have a problem with a reasonable license/permit system for a variety of reasons. I do have a problem with restrictive and prohibitive legislation. Florida is a world apart from Pennsylvania: from the number of importers/exporters and reptile dealers to the number and size of the reptile shows to the many reptile related attractions...reptiles, including venomous, are BIG business. There are a lot more people that are understanding, and accepting, of reptiles; and there is a whole lot more support for the rights of people to keep them (from the people that sell and exploit them)...And those supporters have a big voice and bring lots of revenue to the state. You aren't there any more, Vinny...its cold up here, in more ways than one. And you may have the best intentions in the world with what you are proposing, but I have seen the wheel in motion and it is scary. Being proactive and stepping up to the plate first can sometimes be a good thing, but you'd better have a good solid draft and A LOT of strong support before you present it. You mention safety, and the argument will be "well wouldn't it be safer not to have these dangerous animals in the first place." Then you have to try to defend why we should be allowed to keep venomous reptiles...and that is pretty much a losing battle. AND, with your history, you are (as I mentioned before) the perfect poster child for prohibitive legislation.

Originally Posted by Vinny D

It has nothing to do with that what so ever. like i said it is just for the people who are not experienced, and go to a show and buy a cobra to be cool. floridas laws are great. i can see that you DO NOT HAVE the respect for the safty of proper hot husbandry if you do not agree with a venomous permit system for keepers. it has nothing to do with being a POSTER boy!!

This has nothing to do with "respect for the safety of proper hot husbandry" and everything to do with unecessary legislation. Since you clearly have done extensive research on the need for such legislation in Pennsylvania perhaps you could share some of the data you have collected.

Tell me Vinny - how many teenagers other than yourself have been envenomated by venomous snakes in Pennsylvania in the past 5 years?

How many envenomations have there been to anyone in Pennsylvania (again other than yourself) in the past 5 years?

How many venomous animals are sold in the commonwealth each year?

What percentage of venomous animals sold in Pennsylvania are sold to those under the age of 18?

Im pretty sure 6 people have been envenomated in the past 5 years, but only 2 in captivity including me.

As for how many hot's that were sold in PA i couldent tell you ALOUT. i go to just about every Hamburg show. and i see all kinds of species of hot's leaving the builging.

As far as how many people under the age of 18 have purchased a venomous snake since i have been here. All i know is ALOUT I NEVER see one vendor card someone at a show i have been too.

Im not trying to prove anything. I just think it is a good idea for a permit system in the state of PA, so that people cant just go buy a hot. thats all i was trying to say. this is not something i havent even started, but me and Brint and been talking about it for a while. And he is highly respeced in the world herpetology. I respect you guys and i have listened to alout of the great information i have received from you guys. I know what it is like to almost die from a snake bite.I just dont want it to happen to others.

Originally Posted by Vinny D

It has nothing to do with that what so ever. like i said it is just for the people who are not experienced, and go to a show and buy a cobra to be cool.

So, just for the record, you pretty much described yourself there, Vinny...except you keep going on about all your great experience. Given that, should somebody like you be allowed to purchase venomous?

Originally Posted by Vinny D

i can see that you DO NOT HAVE the respect for the safty of proper hot husbandry if you do not agree with a venomous permit system for keepers.

Well, if that isn't the pot calling the kettle black...what does a permit system have to do with the "safety of proper hot husbandry". As I've said before, you can't regulate stupidity...and reaching your hand into a hot's cage to change the water bowl is, well, stupid. Oh, I know, you've seen the error of your ways...you've learned ALOUT, and you are a responsible keeper now. But you keep talking about your "projects" with one breath, and swearing that you don't work with venomous anymore with the next.

Originally Posted by Vinny D

it has nothing to do with being a POSTER boy!!

Is there anybody reading this thread that can't see Vinny on the poster?

Well, Harald covered that one better than I could.
I'm not a Florida native, and don't have to deal with their laws or anything. But from what I understand, (and correct Me if I am wrong) their guidelines are based on EDUCATION. Meaning so many hours of school and so many hours under a "qualified, and licensed" hot keeper to even apply for the permit to own a hot. This is not a bad thing.
But, when you sart a movement like this it gets carried away fast if all angles are not thought out and planned and checked for loopholes, etc. etc. etc. Like Harald said, some will try for the "no hots at all" point of view, and sadly, a lot (not alout) of people will agree with this. The thing is, most of these people who have the voting power, have never even owned a lizard, let alone a snake, or venomous snake. Which makes them IMHO ignorant of the subject and having no business with this voting power.

Can you see where it would lead to? Bans and restrictive legislation from people who know virtually nothing about the black and white they are voting on.


Rick