So....Who is going to screw up first?

thanks Reptile Kings thats what i was looking for sorry but im not trying to read the history of the lacey act

Originally Posted by Reptile Kings

To put it simply the Lacey Act was the first federal law protecting (all) wildlife (enacted 1900).
Today it's mostly used to prevent the importation or spread of potentially dangerous non-native species.

Mostly, perhaps...
The way Lacey comes into play for most of us, though, is the labeling requirements. Granted, it may default to industry standards; but that means official standards, and it isn't the reptile industry that sets them. This was a bigger problem before FedEx was willing to ship reptiles; but anybody "flying under the radar" by not labeling, or declaring the contents to be something other than living reptiles was in violation of the Lacey Act...and, accordingly, Federal law. Writing that your box contains 5 eastern garter snakes when it contains 5 kingsnakes - same thing.

thats what i was looking for sorry but im not trying to read the history of the lacey act

You don't need to delve deeply into the history, but you SHOULD have a clue what it means if you are shipping animals.

Originally Posted by hhmoore

Mostly, perhaps...
The way Lacey comes into play for most of us, though, is the labeling requirements.

Totally agree with you here. I'm very anal about that here with our service. "Perishable" markings (with no mention at all about 'live harmless reptiles') and misrepresenting what's in the box doesn't fly with me well at all.

You don't need to delve deeply into the history, but you SHOULD have a clue what it means if you are shipping animals.[/quote]


im not going to get into it with u i know what i can and cant ship and i also check to make sure the state im shipping to allows what im shipping in the state i know now what the lacey act is my grandfather told me about it years ago just not that it was called the lacey act i can remember him telling me how taking star fish and sea snakes from the ocean was against the law and there was a law saying so now i know thats the lacey act and it also says somthing about moving or destroying the california poppy thanks tho im glad i am informed on it now

I honestly hope it doesn't happen, for the better of everyone. If we have to follow a law, this would be it.

Originally Posted by hhmoore

It won't be the shipping company that gets in trouble, it will be the people sending and receiving.

I've recently seen someone state the exact opposite. In another thread, I presented someone with a hypothetical scenario where a person's intrastate shipment of a restricted animal ends up going across state lines. The person presented with this scenario - citing 20 years of experience in the shipping industry - claims that FedEx/UPS would be the ones taking the heat for any Lacey Act violations arising from said theoretic shipment, not the private party who actually initiated the shipping. This seems somewhere between counterintuitive and outright foolish to me. Thoughts, anyone?

I received a shipment, FedEx held it, opened it and had the species identified to determine if it was legal to come into this state (it was legal, they thought it was venomous) and then called me to come pick it up. Something triggered them to realize it was a live animal but the box was not marked. Both myself and the shipper received 'warning' letters about the Lacey Act violation. I'd have to dig out the letter to see where it came from. I was surprised I received anything since it was the shipper's fault for not properly marking the box (he said he forgot). Gave me the impression that we were the ones that would get in trouble/be fined, not FedEx. If I remember, I'll try to find the letter, this was a few years ago.

If a shipping company took on a substantial legal liability for shipping live animals, do you think they would even accept that small segment of their business? IMHO, they would drop it in a heart beat. If YOU break the law, then YOU could suffer the penalties, not them. They had nothing at all to do with your decision on how or what you shipped.

Originally Posted by WebSlave

If YOU break the law, then YOU could suffer the penalties, not them. They had nothing at all to do with your decision on how or what you shipped.

From the perspective of a layman who isn't blessed with 20 years in the shipping business, that certainly seems like the most logical, sensible and realistic way of assigning blame. This other person's stance on the scenario seemed like just a lame part of a wholly lame set of rationalizations, but it made me curious enough to throw it out for debate in a more appropriate forum, just in case this is one of those situations where the "common sense" approach ends up being the wrong one.

Originally Posted by Fangthane

From the perspective of a layman who isn't blessed with 20 years in the shipping business, that certainly seems like the most logical, sensible and realistic way of assigning blame. This other person's stance on the scenario seemed like just a lame part of a wholly lame set of rationalizations, but it made me curious enough to throw it out for debate in a more appropriate forum, just in case this is one of those situations where the "common sense" approach ends up being the wrong one.

As an attorney once told me "never confuse the law with logic and common sense."