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Old 10-19-2004, 12:48 AM   #1
nydrgnldy
Sick Leo

Ok I really need some help here.I have a very sick leo.Already been to the vet.She is on parazap fro pinworms and she is still not getting any better.I don't know what else to do.I feeding her by hand Marcia's slurry.She is not gaining any weight.Very lethargic.I just don't know what else to do for her.

My second question....

I bought 2 albino leos from the same lady at the same time.they all had the same care nothing different.They were in the same tank to start with.This sick one was the older of the two.Now why is it that 1 is so sick while the other is the picture of health.They had originally been in the same tank.Once the one got sick I moved the healthy one to a seperate tank.That one has never been sick at all.I don't understand how this happens if they came from the same breeder had originally been in the same tank.One gets sick and the other doesn't .
This is a pic of the healthy one.
 
Old 10-19-2004, 12:51 AM   #2
nydrgnldy
Ok lets try that pic one more time.
Attached Images
 
 
Old 10-19-2004, 12:56 AM   #3
nydrgnldy
And this is the sick one that is supposed to be 1 month older that the one above.
Attached Images
 
 
Old 10-19-2004, 01:50 AM   #4
StinaUIUC
She does not look good...If the problem is intestinal parasites I'd suggest something other than Parazap...not that Parazap is useless, I just doubt that it is strong enough to deal with major parasite problems. Try to get some actual dewormer from your vet. It sounds like you are doing everything you can for her...how old is she? It's possible that it's failure to thrive syndrome and there's just nothing you can do. I'm sorry that she's doing so poorly...good luck in getting her better!
 
Old 10-19-2004, 02:17 PM   #5
LadyGecko
Hi- I also have a similar problem with 2 babies that I had mentioned in another "sick Leo" thread and after a trip to the vet and a course of Panacur( for pinworm) I am just waiting to see if they will get better.
I have been feeding with Marcias slurry as neither one had shown much interest in food and they both were starting to lose weight.
Previously they had been given a course of Parazap -upon aquiring them (as all my herps are) and I have never before had a paracite problem with my Leos.
I am used to geting babies and putting them in a viv and feeding and watching them grow like weeds.
With not ever having any major problems with baby Leos before i had put all of my babies together as they were aquired at aproximately the same time and were all very close in size and age.
Now i see the error of that practice.


This is a new and very unpleasant experience for me and I am doing everything that I possibly can to save these two little ones.
Can you please elaborate on "Failure To Thrive" syndrome.
I have 3 other juvie Leos(kept seperately from these two) that were aquired around the same time and have had not one problem with them and they are growing like weeds.
Interestingly enough- one of these thriving babies is from the same place that Robin got her 2 babies.

Thanks for your reples and any info is greatly appreciated
Sandy
 
Old 10-19-2004, 03:29 PM   #6
riverjop
Robin & Sandra

Since Pin worms have a direct life cycle, your geckos probably got them through contaminated food &/or water. That would be food and water that was in contact with fecal matter, and since the one gecko was infected it wouldn't be a bad idea to treat all your rep's just to make sure. Pin worms are common in many reptiles, it's when the reptile is kept constantly in one place IE; a cage That they become continually exposed to there own & others fecal matter, thus continuing the cycle. The "failure to survive syndrome" basically is when the animal just gives up and no longer has the will (or the strength) to continue living. There could be other problems and other parasites that your Geckos might have! Did your vet find any other problems like Coccidia or Flagellates? They are treated with other medicine such as Albon and Flagyl, but you really need to know for sure what exactly are the parasites that are involved!
One thing for sure for you or anyone who is serious about keeping reptiles is that you should get yourself A book called "UNDERSTANDING REPTILE PARASITES" by Roger Klingenberg or any other good comprehensive book on the subject. You can usually find them at better pet shops or you can go on-line at Amazon.com and get them.

Dang!!! does that sound like and ad...or what!!! LOL
Anyway best of luck, and remember Clean-Clean-Clean!!! Stop the cycle!
 
Old 10-19-2004, 06:37 PM   #7
LadyGecko
Thank you for your reply. I respect the experience and the knowledge of the members of ths forum.
From what the vet said from the fecal exam there were no elevated levels of coccidia and the pin worms were the only other problem that showed up.
As far as understanding Reptile Parasite's -I can see a need to know what I am dealing with but I find it incredible that in the 8 years of keeping and Breeding Bearded Dragons and keeping many other herps including a 4 yr old green iggy that was a rescue as an almost dead baby -a Blue Tongue Skink- many Leopard Geckos-the oldest which are 6 or 7 years old and the picture of health-that I have never had any major parasite problems.
A bit of background on me which will perhaps make it understood why I am so puzzled by this whole parasite problem is:

It just has never happened to me before.

I am partially disabled and my animals are my reason for getting up each and every morning and i give them all individual optimal daily care. Their tanks are given fresh paper towels on a daily basis-water bowls are washed with a mild bleach solution and a general inspection and quality time is spent with each animal every day to make sure that everything is as it should be with them.
They are fed on a daily basis- babies of course more frequently and with the leos-calcium and mealies are always present in the tank.
My crickets and mealies and supers are supplied fresh on a weekly basis from an insect breeder that lives approx. 20 miles from me-i am extremely fortunate in this respect and I have never had any problems with his insects carrying parasites in the past years.
I have had remarkable growth rates with my leos in the past and next to no worries with any of them until this year when I purchased 4 or 5 babies from various sources.
It was my mistake to house all the babies together- i see that now- but with not ever having any previous problem doing that with my Dragons or Leos that i have kept up until now- I honestly had no reason to expect that different babies all coming into my home roughly at the same time would have a problem being housed in the same nursery viv.
However- there is no excuse for ignorance and i will never again do this.
I use parazap on every herp that comes into this house and while i understand it's limited properties- it has seemed to have kept all my herps in optimum health.
Obviously i have been extremely lucky in the past not to have encountered any leos that came into my house carrying parasites nor have I smed o have had a problem with parasites from my feeder insects.
I am not trying to be overly defensive or snooty about this- i am simply stating what my animal husbandry is like and why this comes as such a shock to me.
The two babies in question are still hanging in there( they are still very alert and active and I still have hope for them) and i will work with them until they get back to good health-fingers crossed.
I will get the book recommended-it does sound like a very good reference to have on hand and I have also decided not to purchase any more baby leos in the near future. If I do get more leos they will be at least 30 to 40 gram sub adults and will of course be quarantined and treated with parzap as my usual routine.
I wonder -does it have anything to do at with the morphs that i am working with?
I have read several places that the Blizzard morphs can be difficult to get to "Take Off"-but then that doesn't explain the problem with the baby tang except through cross contamination as was suggested by riverjop.
I am making every effort to stop the cycle and also take the precautions of thoroughly cleaning my hands in between handling any of the animals and I sincerely hope to have this problem eradicated before long.
Thanks again for your replies and advice
A devoted animal care giver and lover
Sandy
Attached Images
 
 
Old 10-19-2004, 07:53 PM   #8
humpbacks1962
Mine is recovering from those disgusting pinworms the careless breeder did not even bother to check on.
I am lucky that I always placed my lizards on individual tanks. Otherwise, they'd all be sick now.

She is not losing weight on the slurry, but I have to trick her into eating it sometimes. I have to warm it up to room temperature and feed with a syringe. I have to warm it up several times during a feeding, sometimes.

She has been on Panacur for two weeks already, and is still unable to hold solid foods. The slurry is the only thing she won't throw up.

I can only hope she'll recover, but there have been days I have not felt so sure. This Friday she finishes her last dose of Panacur. I will have her poopi re-tested. You'd think she'd be doing better by now, but she is still not a self-feeder.

Do animals with these infections recover at all?
 
Old 10-19-2004, 09:43 PM   #9
Golden Gate Geckos
sick geckos

Sometimes, if the parsite infection has been left untreated for too long, the lining of the intestines can become damaged, and this could cause malabsorption of food nutrients. However, it must be a serious infection to keep them from eating. Usually, pinworm infestations do not cause such serious anorexia unless left ignored or treated with the incorrect medication.

I suspect there is something going on secondary to the pinworms. You could be dealing with a bacterial infection which does not show up on routine fecal smears and floats. A stool sample is sent to a lab and grown as a culture, and the bacterium are identified and tested for antibiotic sensitivity. Many of these infections are treatable if caught early enough.

Now, in regard to feeding the slurry... keep in mind that if a gecko is given this as a steady diet, it will not hunt for live prey if it has a full belly and isn't hungry. Not to mention that it can become lazy because it doesn't have to put forth too much effort while being dropper fed!
 
Old 10-19-2004, 09:49 PM   #10
humpbacks1962
Yes, this was a nasty infestation. So bad the pinworm eggs caused impaction in the poor thing. I took her to the vet as soon as I noticed something wrong, did not wait for her to look like a string bean. And still, I hope it was not too late.

I hope she recovers, but definitely the infestation hurt the lining of her stomach more than I ever thought. I will keep handfeeding her the slurry, but regurgitating her own skin shed is not a good sign. She never regurgitates that miraculous slurry...
 

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