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Board of Inquiry® This forum is provided exclusively for the discussion of specific persons or businesses in the herp industry. |
11-16-2011, 04:07 AM
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#11
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Apparently, you are missing my point - perhaps I didn't explain it well enough, but I'm going to pick up with your last post and tie in some things. (Sorry, but starting the thread doesn't mean your side of things is perfect, or won't be addressed).
You got paid. Check.
You were asked to ship to Stacy. Check.
You advised Stacy that this wasn't acceptable, and why. Check.
Stacy said it was okay to ship to Courtney. Check
Everything so far seems fairly reasonable....but there is no indication that you discussed with Courtney that you would be shipping to her. Did you simply assume it was acceptable because she paid (or because Stacy agreed to your policy)?
I guess I can understand why you might, especially given some of your statements; but it seems odd that you would ship snakes to a person that might be unaware, unavailable, or unwilling to receive them. Perhaps you did communicate with her prior to telling her that you had dropped the snakes off, but chose not to reveal that - I don't really care, to be honest. I'm not trying to turn this on you, your part is your part. You can be content with how you do things, or consider how you might do them better.
As far as Courtney's response, on one hand, I agree with your assessment (based on the fragmented information you have provided). It does have a bad feel, and there might be good reason for concern. Or, she could have been reacting to last minute information that was unacceptable to her. Much as I hate to admit it, I have chosen to take a hard line and cancel a transaction in the face of a change that was unacceptable to me (but pushed by a seller); so, while I may not agree with some parts of her described reaction, I can also understand some of it.
I would love to hear the other side of this....unfortunately, it sounds unlikely that Courtney is a member. Would you be willing to provide Stacy's username, or to direct her to this thread?
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11-16-2011, 12:29 PM
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#12
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HH, I've justified ever action I made and you just keep pushing the issue. Why? Why are you so set on trying to find something I did wrong??? Now to address your last post.....
Why do I need to talk to Courtney? Just to clear this up further, I contacted Courtney when I saw her name on the Paypal address. She told me to ship to Stacy. I told her no....... and after this post I'm done here. You can have the last word if you'd like HH. I really could give a shit less at this point. All you had to do is say, "Hey thanks for the heads up Playboid. I'll be careful if I see something from one of them." You couldn't do that? I didn't smear either one of them. All I said was a transaction fell through and it seemed fishy. I volunteered the rest of the info to ease your mind HH. Now i wish I wouldn't have said anything.
I would have no problems contacting Stacy and having her post here. You also have all the right in the world to question how I handle things. In some cases, it's necessary. In this one, it wasn't. You remind me of the bored, lonely guy at home that just looks for reasons to argue with people. I was that guy for a long time. It's ugly. Get over it. You feel a lot better. To justify my assessment of you, look at the statement under your handle, "tired and cranky" moderator. Take a xanax and go to bed then.
You and I obviously don't see eye to eye on some issues and we can argue until our fingers are swollen and red from typing, but let's agree to disagree. I don't feel I need to hold a buyers hand through an entire transaction. Everything Stacy said had held true. She said she wanted the animals, she said when she'd pay for them, she paid when she indicated, at what point should I stop dealing with Stacy and start dealing with the paypal account holder? After I received the paypal payment? FUNNY THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT I DID! I emailed the paypal user and asked for permission to ship the snakes. She called and left me a message saying it was ok to ship to Stacy's address. I returned the call and with a message saying it wasn't ok, at which point stacy emailed me and said it was ok to ship to Courtney's. There was obviously a lack of communication through Stacy and Courtney, not on my part. I'm not going to keep emailing and calling 5 different numbers and emails to confirm all of this. I have a life. I have things to do. I don't have all day to sit and confirming shipping with several people about one box. The item is paid for, the shipping was confirmed, I'm shipping. Period. Not my problem anymore. That's why there's shipping insurance through both the payment site and the shipping site. Let Courtney and Stacy deal with Courtney and Stacy.
I can see that you feel it's your obligation to micromanage a transaction, and that's great you do. I don't. If Courtney was friends enough to let Stacy use her paypal, crucify me for believing Stacy when she said ship it to Courtney's and Courtney's boyfriend or Stacy would be there to accept the package. Everything was weird, but seemed ok until the phone call from Courtney when I was walking into the FedEx building. That's when I decided I was cancelling the transaction and refunding the money. I went home, called paypal to inform them they may have some sort of fraud scam going and they may want to monitor Courtney's account and that's when I received the "claims email" from paypal that Courtney put in a claim for unreceived items.
I delete emails when transactions are finished. I do not know Stacy's handle. I will email her and ask her to post her side of the story here to ease your mind HH. If she does great, maybe you'll get whatever it is you are looking for Harold. Some times getting to the bottom of a situation is helpful and necessary. Sometimes people are just antagonists. Just like you posted your opinion, I'll post mine, I think you're just pushing a pointless issue. Why, I don't know. If you want to find a way to point fingers at me instead, then go for it. Continue on. I personally am agreeing to disagree. I posted this as an info post, not a "bad guy" post. I thought I was helping inform people. Instead I ended up just bothering myself with having to defend how I do things. Again, no more BOI posting for me. Back to my strict policy of don't post unless personally addressed.
Good Luck in your Quest for Knowledge HH. It's situations like this that turn away people from posting in the BOI and other big forums anymore. It's not worth the headache. Maybe you'll be the next person that gets hustled and it may have been prevented if people would just say thank you and encourage BOI posts, not pick them apart like I'm on the stand in a courtroom.
To anyone who wasted their time reading all of this, I apologize. Again, this was not where I thought this thread would go. For anyone who thinks I'm angry and overreacting, you are probably correct. I'm just baffled how trying to look out for other herpers turned into me being questioned, criticized, and having to explain and defend myself. I've attempted to end this thread twice now. Find some one else to bother Harald.
Take Care BOI. I'm not going to miss you.
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11-16-2011, 12:33 PM
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#13
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It sounds like a scam was in the making from these two individuals.
Only after they thought you had already sent the snake they act like that?
Have they been notified of this post, I'd love to hear their story, but doubt they'll make an appearance.
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11-16-2011, 12:51 PM
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#14
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I agree with Playboid. This was a scam in the making, and i am glad he did not follow through. The buyers side of this deal was the problem, and their lack of communication or plan of a scam faultered, leaving Wayne in the right. No doubt this was scam, and now this is blown out of proportion, just my entitled opinion from the knowledge posted on this BOI
. Peace to all, Happy Holidays
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11-16-2011, 01:20 PM
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#15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Playboid
Take Care BOI. I'm not going to miss you.
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And I'm sure it will just KILL us to be without YOU here....
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11-16-2011, 01:22 PM
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#16
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Wayne, not sure what your problem is here. I didn't see anything Harald posted as 'trying to find what you did wrong', it's normal on BOI threads to ask for as much information as possible. You provided much more after his first inquiry which helped explain the situation a lot. It's also standard procedure in BOI threads to alert the other party so they can tell their side of the story. This is a public forum and people are allowed to share their thoughts and opinions.
People handle their business differently and personally before I ship, I do re-verify the address and ask to ensure someone will be there to receive the delivery.
I also found many of your remarks to Harald quite rude, my opinion of course.
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11-16-2011, 01:26 PM
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#17
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It sounds fishy to me as well.
I do want to mention something to you tho- not in an argumentative way or anything- but just to perhaps have you see another view. Now, I agree Courtney didnt handle things right IMHO, and prolly really could have been a scam in the making ( and I appreciate the heads up)
But- as a seller who is shipping a live animal- if this was me- I would want to make sure the person who is receiving( in this case the person who bought it for someone else- if it was not a scam) the snake is crystal clear the snake is going to their address and on that day AND they can recieve it....
Jump to being a buyer- if I buy a snake for, say rob- made up name- you talk to rob and say you have to ship it to me, the one whose paypal account was used to send money. You ship the snake w.o contacting me because you dont think you need to, then call me- well, guess what- I wont be there because I am in some kind of obligation that I cannot get out of ( or you call rob and he cannot get a hold of me to tell me its shipped). If that snake sits on my doorstep to freeze or cook, and it is dead by the time I get it- it wasn't my fault ( buyer) that there was no contact from the seller( or rob could not get a hold of me) that the snake was coming- ergo- I want a full refund, and you can be out the snake and its value... I will not be out the money because there was no clear communication from the shipper- and the shipper is the one who has the control of how the snake is shipped and when, not the buyer IMHO.
So with that said- as a seller, I wouldn't want to loose the snake and its value. I wouldn't assume Stacey got a hold of Courtney to make sure everything is ok- especially with not hearing conformation back from stacey OR being contacted by Courtney that it is indeed a go ahead on shipping. I'd rather hold someones hand through a transaction then to have a snake loose its life due to sitting on a step to cook/freeze and/or be out the value as well.
But- I don't know if I would have even followed through with this transaction. if a person doesn't have paypal, there are other forms of payment i would take. If their is a hold or something on the paypal- then that would make me wonder if i want to do business with them. I have a busy schedule as well- kinda- i work night shift, so shipping a snake out cuts into my sleeping time- I understand it is very time consuming and all with finalizing a sale- but i would rather spend time ensuring the safety of the snake then not to suffer the worst case scenario. I see it as just the nature of the biz- especially when its a live animal.
I am glad you still have the snake and just gave the refund to end this. I never imagined this scenerio, and it gave me some food for thought.
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11-16-2011, 01:58 PM
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#18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Playboid
Take Care BOI. I'm not going to miss you.
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Cool off and come back. The BOI is serious biz, not a creampuff bakery, so often those posting ask probing questions to get the facts. This is ultimately for your benefit, scammers do not need to be treated with kid gloves, but those who have done no wrong deserve exoneration, and sometimes a lot of energy goes into separating the wolves from the sheep.
Harald has rough edges sometimes, but he has high standards and is totally honest. He's on the side of justice and honesty. Aren't you too?
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