Alterna Rush the movie, Small Scale Films, Dan Krull

Originally Posted by Rextiles

These posts are from Facebook.com and FieldHerpForums.com.

3rd party anonymous quotes or not; it definitely looks like Dan should have been much more proactive about contacting and refunding those who'd explicitly paid for a DVD. In the internet era, there's simply no excuse for being out of contact - especially when he acknowledges that some people felt like they paid for a product that wasn't provided. His avoidance is definitely a strike against him. It's relevant info that people can use to gauge his character. However, if those are the best you have, I still don't think you've come even close to the character assassination that you were looking for. While it hasn't been handled in a particularly acceptable time frame, it seemingly is being handled. Unless, of course, you have current, verifiable info to the contrary.

That string of emails that Justin posted seems much more interesting than pretty much everything else. Not necessarily for the parts that were about Dan, either. Doesn't seem like there are any saints in that crowd.

Originally Posted by Snake-Queen

all others are hearsay

Hearsay would be if I said: "I saw a post of a guy who said that Dan took his money and did not delivery his dvd.". That would be hearsay because I'm telling you about what someone else said and there is no verifiable means of determining if what I have told you is the truth.

However, I have not done this.

What I have done is to show first hand screenshots of what people have actually said when they said it on public forums. I have also included the urls at the top of each screenshot so that people can independently examine this evidence as it appears for all of the public to see.

The bottom line is, Gregg and I both made claims that there were a significant amount of people that were inquiring about what happened to their money and purchases. We were asked to provide such proof that these people did exist as well as these posts. I have provided such proof to back up these claims.

Originally Posted by Fangthane

I still don't think you've come even close to the character assassination that you were looking for.

I'm sorry that you believe that this is my intent or motive but I can assure that it is not. If my intention was to assassinate Dan's character, I would have stirred this up over the summer when I first found out about all of it. I only got involved when I saw that Gregg had first posted and failed to provide the evidence that I knew actually existed. I only got involved because I felt that it was in the best interest of the community to at least see the facts as they actually exist and not based on just what Dan has been saying to smooth things over.

Originally Posted by Rextiles

Hearsay would be if I said: "I saw a post of a guy who said that Dan took his money and did not delivery his dvd.". That would be hearsay because I'm telling you about what someone else said and there is no verifiable means of determining if what I have told you is the truth.

Essentially, yes you have. By posting screenshots from random sites that do not require full names to be posted, it is considered hearsay. These quotes have no identifying proponents as to the authors of them.

Originally Posted by Rextiles

However, I have not done this.

What I have done is to show first hand screenshots of what people have actually said when they said it on public forums. I have also included the urls at the top of each screenshot so that people can independently examine this evidence as it appears for all of the public to see.

The bottom line is, Gregg and I both made claims that there were a significant amount of people that were inquiring about what happened to their money and purchases. We were asked to provide such proof that these people did exist as well as these posts. I have provided such proof to back up these claims.

I do not doubt that there are people who "bought" a DVD and have not received a refund. I also have no doubt that Dan K. will rectify this as soon as he can.

5/6 people is your definition of significant? I didn't count all the screenshots, for the reason that they cannot be attributed to different people ... if they were all on the same site, like KS for instance, I would be more apt to believe that they were individual people. My reasoning for this is, I am a member of several forums, but don't always use the same user name.

As for Gregg, those who live in glass houses, shouldn't throw stones.
It appears his friends/business partners are party to worse than this situation, as alluded to, by Justin.

Originally Posted by Rextiles

Hearsay would be if I said: "I saw a post of a guy who said that Dan took his money and did not delivery his dvd.". That would be hearsay because I'm telling you about what someone else said and there is no verifiable means of determining if what I have told you is the truth.

However, I have not done this.

What I have done is to show first hand screenshots of what people have actually said when they said it on public forums. I have also included the urls at the top of each screenshot so that people can independently examine this evidence as it appears for all of the public to see.

The bottom line is, Gregg and I both made claims that there were a significant amount of people that were inquiring about what happened to their money and purchases. We were asked to provide such proof that these people did exist as well as these posts. I have provided such proof to back up these claims.

I highly agree, and thank you Troy for providing ACTUAL and VISIBLE proof, and not just reciting, verbatim, what you are saying someone said.

Originally Posted by Fangthane

it definitely looks like Dan should have been much more proactive about contacting and refunding those who'd explicitly paid for a DVD. In the internet era, there's simply no excuse for being out of contact - especially when he acknowledges that some people felt like they paid for a product that wasn't provided.

Originally Posted by Dan Krull

About 50 people pre paid for dvds. Most of them definitely saw their gift as a purchase, which is why I feel it is important to give them refunds.

Dan

Originally Posted by Dan Krull

Here is an updated phone number for anyone who donated and would like an update. 913 709 5865. To answer Gregg's ( who never donated a dime to the project) inquiry, yes, over 500 dollars of donations have been returned, and I am slowly going down the list in the order they were received. I am grateful for the few people who were kind enough to try to make the project work, and still amazed at how almost none of them are posting negative comments here. Strangely enough, it is only those who never helped, donated, or even bought a t shirt who choose to accuse me of a scam.


Dan Krull
Nasicus@hotmail.com

Dan has said he is going to refund those who paid for DVDs. I agree with Dan Graybeal that Dan Krull should have notified those on the list that a refund was forthcoming, since a list of the buyers is apparently available.
I think a lot of criticism going forward could be headed off if contact was made now. It might take a few days to notify the balance of those on the list if for instance there is only a phone number or address and no email, but I think it may be time well spent.

Yes, to what Lucille said. If Dan Krull were to simply refund all of the folks on his list, this would simply pass. Really, it is just the ethical thing to do. After reading this thread, I believe everyone who purchased a copy of this DVD did so with the intent of receiving a product. I see nothing that leads me to believe the unfortunate buyers were making a contribution to Dan's "non-profit" group. But because it was a relatively small amount of money, per person, most buyers have just written it off. Or so Dan hoped.

Originally Posted by tim brophy

Or so Dan hoped.

We don't know that, and I don't think that is the case if Dan is, as he has claimed, going down the list in the order received and making refunds.
My point is that were he to notify everyone that a refund is coming, that might be a better way to handle the situation. He may not have the funds to do all the refunds immediately, but if he makes a good faith effort and the people on the list are satisfied, that would be in my opinion a good solution.

Originally Posted by tim brophy

After reading this thread, I believe everyone who purchased a copy of this DVD did so with the intent of receiving a product. I see nothing that leads me to believe the unfortunate buyers were making a contribution to Dan's "non-profit" group.

Especially when Dan was consistently advertising it as a product to purchase...

(quotes taken directly from included screen shots)

"Day two of the sale! If you are having trouble with the button to buy the DVD, click it once and let the paypal cart screen load. It will take several seconds.Reserve your copy now!"

"Pre-sale is now in day two. Be sure to get a copy today! Help broadcast a positive media message to lawmakers and the general public! When you click the button to buy, wait several seconds for the paypal cart to show-up."

"The pre-sale went live today! Reserve your copy of the "Alterna Junkies Edition" of Alterna Rush the Movie. Only 100 available, so act fast!"

I don't see anywhere in any of those statements that he says anything about donations or fundraisers. I see things like "buy the dvd", "sale", "pre-sale", "get a copy today", "click the button to buy" and "only 100 available" (which implies that he's sitting on 100 of these to actually sell).

I was one of the people who paid $50 for the "pre-order", which also included my name being credited. It was most definitely for a pre-order of the DVD, and not a donation.

I have not, to this day, received a refund.