Paradigm shift

Originally Posted by WebSlave

I
putting information about someone where it would do the most good for people interested. I made no comments or claims about those posts either way. They were posted simply as a FYI. Anyone reading them can make their own decisions about them.

I agree that prospective purchasers should be able to check out more facets of vendors they anticipate doing business with. It will help them to be able to check out the FYI posts.

I think the way people act (and talk) is in fact relevant to how they do business, and debate about this fact might be interesting but is unneccessary, as now, the potential customers who will now have a more complete view of their vendors will make the ultimate decisions about their prospective vendors via their purchasing power.
THAT'S the ultimate answer to the way one chooses to display one's self in public.

Money talks, BS walks.

Rich and Lucille,
I would agree that deciding to append someone's "Good Guy" thread with some of their profane diatribes when they have shown themselves to be a social "not so good guy" is a legitimate function of the site and your prerogative. Of course, this requires a "good guy" thread. But even then, the perpetrator is not banned, and anyone doing research on the entity may have to read several pages (or 10-20 posts) of "best of the west" before coming upon the incriminating self-immolation. Using that thread as an example, we now have one Alan H., 800+ posts but unknown to me, who may not have a good guy thread (for the sake of argument, lets assume he does not). His posts clearly rate a permanent ban, as does Greg's. If every post by Greg, and now Alan, had something akin to "Banned for Cause" and a link to the offending ban, then every entity that came here would quickly get the lowdown. Even with you current efforts, I think anyone researching these two entities in a couple of months would still be less than likely to find these illuminating posts, while still seeing enough to assume that they are members in good standing. IMO, there are lines that should not be crossed in your site. This rush to be banned will subside quickly, while the desire by miscreants to inject their diatribes will continue ad-nausea. Are we headed back to the flame wars and nonsensical hijackings ? I don't see the lessening of the rules as encouraging more in terms of enlightened contribution and worthy discussion and debate ..... just a denigration of the site.

hey Jim ... white man who speak with forked tounge should not cast rocks at his own glass house.

Alan,
Hope all is well In NC. Always liked that state. Did seven years there at Ft. Bragg with the 82nd and then 5th SF. They were good times.
To all others. Despite Alan's posts in the rejuvenated Greg Holland Good Guy thread in the BOI, and now here, which I couldn't have written any better to illustrate my point, he is not on my payroll.

Let me preface what I am about to say with this: I have been a member here since the early days, and I respect Rich for both what he has been able to create here and for accepting the seemingly endless aggravation that it has brought upon him.

Those that know me, also know that I rarely choose to become involved in the types of threads that promote internal bickering and name calling. I simply choose to spend my time helping where I can in the informational forums.

In my opinion, this is the single best reptile-related site available. The BOI is a tremendous resource for our community, the discussion forums are free from self-serving censorship, and the classifieds, are effective.

It has become apparent over the last couple of weeks, that Rich has grown very weary of trying to referee all of the different personalities that exist here. We all know how busy this time of year is for those of us that breed large numbers of animals. That workload, combined with all the drama here of late, seems to have taken it's toll.

I agree with the decision to relax the rules a bit. I think it will allow for a much more free exchange of information here. After all, that is what this is all about.

I also agree with the decision to allow posting on the BOI by Registered Members. Although it opens up the opportunity for some unscrupulous people to post under false pretenses, one of the strengths of this site has always been the ability of it's members to see through such things and ferret out the bad guys.

Perhaps working on such things together, will deter those people with more time then projects from seeking out or creating issues with other members here. Kind of the old "idle hands" theory.

The one thing that I have to disagree with however, is the appending of posts and or private emails to existing threads. In both of the cases where I saw this today, it seemed very obvious that both of these were done out of spite. I think that each of these could have been addressed in either the existing thread, or in this one where they belong.

In the case of the first individual, it was evident that he was trying to get banned. I certainly cannot understand the reasoning there - if you don't like it here, just don't come here. However, the reasoning given for appending his communication was so that people could make an informed decision about him.

I cannot buy into that. If he had simply been banned as he wanted, anyone looking him up here would very likely see that he had been banned. It would then be a simple matter to click on his profile and see his last post. To add those posts to his Good Guy post was uncalled for in my mind.

Hopefully, all of us as a group can get past all of these recent personality conflicts and bring this site back to it's intended purpose - to be the single best source of information on reptile dealings available anywhere.

Thank you,

Mike,

I think it is an attempt to put more info on people into one area. I would still have gone with the warning points area or something similiar that is linked to the type of posts that are made that truly reveal character.

Myself and I would think this extends beyond me, who won't deal with types that act like Greg did at the end when there are many professionals out there to choose from.

Rich attaching that email is to make it easier for people to see the big picture far easier. However this could become a huge workload considering the number of such posts soem people make.

Well here is my perspective, coming from someone who has been effected by the "rules system(s)" that have been enacted on this site. As a bit of background, this is the first post I have made in nearly a year, Im sure Rich or someone could figure out my last one iff they wanted. So I fall into the group of "lookers" that never posts. However when this site first came around I would like to think I was a very active, and at times informative member of the community.

By nature I am a bit hot headed. I imagine I am more the norm in the "old" reptile community than an anomoly (sp?). Tattoos, hard drinking, hard life, ect just dont seem to run well with rules. As such when the rules came around I found myself on the outside looking in. However I would venture a guess that you would be very hard pressed to find anyone who would say Im a "bad guy" a "crook" or a "scam" as the boi used to be great at finding.

When the rules first came around, I got myself into a fight with a number of people. They used my temper and the rules of the site against me to aid me into getting into trouble that still haunts me to this day. Luck would have it one of the people I was in a "pissing match" with was a moderator on the site. I dont want to dwell so thats as far as Im going.

Now as time has gone on and the rules have changed and changed I have tried to stick around. Well about a year ago I got banned yet again from the site. This time it was for a signature violation, and of course as luck would have it it was the moderator I was fighting with a year prior. Now at the time of the suspension for the signature, I wasnt really actively posting. I wasnt fighting with anyone, and most of all I hadnt changed the signature in over a year. I was rather blindsided by the suspension, and due to the fact that moderator gave it I was left with a very bad taste in my mouth towards this site I once loved.

Now as my upbringing would dictate, I am also hard headed. I didnt want to pay the suspension, and refused to do so for almost 8 months. When I finally did, the first thing I tried to do was change my signature so as to not get fined yet again right out the gun. This was a few months ago, and I still havent been able to change the signature. I was told I needed to pay to post on the boi, and since I hadnt the signature wasnt a issue as I couldnt post. Now I can, but still havent been able to fix the signature, so I hope I dont get booted yet again.

I applaude anything that gets the boi back to the days of old. I think pay to post keeps alot of information from getting out. Im not poor by any measure, but on principal alone I was done giving this site that tried to get rid of me money.

I know Rich used the money to get rid of the trash, ect. Well if Im trash by all means let me know and I will show myself the door. I however feel Im a valued part of this community. I know a large number of the people in this business first hand. When I say something about someone, I would like to believe I am giving good information that may help keep someone from getting robbed, or better yet help they make a smart choice on a quality business. I love nothing more then to talk up other people I have had great deals with when people inquire, but again the rules kept me from doing even that at the end.

Anyways thats my useless two cents.

NOTICE MY SIGNATURE IS A BANNABLE OFFENCE< IM AWARE AND TRYING TO FIX IT. HECK THE LINE WITH MY ADDRESS IS INCORRECT ID LOVE TO JUST DROP IT....HINT HINT

Mickey, you are far from trash around here, in fact I am pleased to see you post again. In my book, you are one of the best people I have ever had the opportunity to do business with.

As far as the rule changes that have happened, I will refrain from posting my opinion about it.

Originally Posted by Mickey_TLK

NOTICE MY SIGNATURE IS A BANNABLE OFFENCE< IM AWARE AND TRYING TO FIX IT. HECK THE LINE WITH MY ADDRESS IS INCORRECT ID LOVE TO JUST DROP IT....HINT HINT

How do you figure that the signature area is an offense that can get you banned, Mickey?

Here's a screen shot of the warning list. Now I do understand that there may be some inconsistencies as the rule changes (or lack thereof) have not been reflected everywhere pertinent on this site. But still I believe you are mistaken with your comment.

And for the record, your signature area does not appear unless you are a Contributor member or above.

Im sorry Rich, I sorta misspoke on that. I meant it could get ME suspended, not banned. Just a minor typo.

Any warning point gets me suspended as I allready have to many warning points. So even a 1 point offence, and Im sending money. Thats all I was getting at, please dont take that post the wrong way. Im honestly not trying to start any ____. I was just adding my input.

As for the last part about the signature, when I hit preview it showed my signature, that still had the wrong address and too many lines. As such I assumed it was going to show in the reply Now it also shows a place to remove the signature, but I actually do perfer to have one attached, as I never sign anything when I type. Guess I need to start now...LOL

Mickey Hinkle
The Lizard King Reptiles