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Old 10-24-2012, 10:53 AM   #171
Lucille
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mimmieux View Post
let's see what Mr. Hoser has to say about this!
In the past, responses of many to information on this site tending to show guilt have been: innocent, guilty, no contest, no response.
There is a new sort of response made famous in another thread: the responder will simply blather long enough and loud enough enough so that the incriminating post is washed away to previous pages so that it will not be read.

Mr. Hoser has picked fights, written derogatory answers including several that target how he feels about certain Christian groups, and has discoursed at length with less than factual information, so he is skilled in using argument to pull attention away from relevant postings..

Dan writes so much better than I do so I'm including a quote here:
Quote:
Originally Posted by ApexPredatorBoids View Post
This guy reminds me of the clowns at BallBids. Making contradictory and self-serving statements, with no basis in any sensible plane of reality. And he even has a magic link that'll dispel any arguments. Deja-vu all over again.

'Oh, you don't agree with me? Here, just have a look at my handy-dandy link. This'll explain it all. Quantifiable data? Crikey, mate, who needs that!? I said it, so it must be the truth.'
It is my opinion that he will use the blather tactic here.
Should he do so, I will simply bring the very much relevant post back up to the top.
 
Old 10-24-2012, 11:06 AM   #172
Mimmieux
I've been over this thread beginning to end and he has exhibited every detail you e described one by one. All I was simply saying is I wonder how he'll weasel out of this one.
 
Old 10-24-2012, 12:15 PM   #173
Fangthane
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucille View Post
There is a new sort of response made famous in another thread: the responder will simply blather long enough and loud enough enough so that the incriminating post is washed away to previous pages so that it will not be read.

Mr. Hoser has picked fights, written derogatory answers including several that target how he feels about certain Christian groups, and has discoursed at length with less than factual information, so he is skilled in using argument to pull attention away from relevant postings..
The old "Dazzling display of defense". Spew a long enough filibuster, and maybe we'll lose interest in contesting that which doesn't successfully get buried in his rantings. I wouldn't say it's new, but it seems to be making a bit of a comeback.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mimmieux View Post
I wonder how he'll weasel out of this one.
He really can't. Despite one's individual stance on the venomoid debate, I'd have to think that anyone who actually reads his posts realizes that his rationalizations are extremely subjective, twisted, contrived, self-serving, and generally fictitious. He sees himself as a promoter. He doesn't care what he has to say, so long as he gathers a big enough crowd to sell some tickets.

Having watched some of his YouTube videos, where he's constantly kissing his maimed snakes, I believe he amounts to little more than a motley-garbed jester. He'll prance around, take a few tumbles, and sing some nonsensical songs. Nevermind the fact that everyone's laughing at him and his antics; it's the attention, itself, that he craves. That's what's likely to keep him coming back with a similar song and dance.
 
Old 10-25-2012, 08:51 PM   #174
Snake-Queen
I use a rubber tipped hook, which resides in my snake room (ambient temp is roughly 72 - 78f), to remove some very aggressive yearling boas. From my experience the hook calms them to a point of handlabilty (meaning I don't get bitten), whereas when I remove them with my hand(s) I ALWAYS get bitten. So it is my OPINION & observation that using a hook is NOT traumatic or inhumane in any way.

Before I read this whole thread (although I did skim some of adder's posts) I thought the surgery was the way to go to prevent accidents from happening. I no longer think this is the case. Reptiles feel pain, to do this to them without pain management is inhumane and horrible.

I want to own a few hots but now I will wait till I can get the proper training on handling them. I will never mutilate a thing of beauty for my own "safety".
 
Old 10-26-2012, 04:52 PM   #175
adder
Dear all,

Snakehandler posted:
“all your claims against me have been thrown out of court as baseless”.

Not so!

In fact you admitted in court last year that you had engaged in unlawful stalking and harassment of myself and my business, including via internet hate sites and stated you had acted unwisely and would cease and desist, which you have clearly not done. You failed this year to get a court intervention order against me in the County Court, as the judge found you had engaged in an abuse of process to attack our lawful business.

Your false public comments against me here on this chat forum and elsewhere do provide us with further grounds of action against you.

We have in force at the moment court intervention orders against no less than three of your associates, obviously issued because the courts (individual magistrates) agreed the evidence against them was overwhelming.

It is established fact that you have breached various rules and regulations and have induced others to do so. That you have not been prosecuted and penalized for these is scandalous. Furthermore you have publicly boasted of your own breaching of wildlife laws in writing!
Once again, you are asked to cease and desist from any bootlegging or tarnishing of our IP!

Now turning to some of the other noisy posters here, the Wikipedia hate page about me has no credibility whatsoever. You should also be aware that it is blocked from amendment and corrections.

In terms of venomoids and vet surgeons, Dr Funk, with an academic pedigree far in excess of the posters here has publicly backed our venomoids several times.

I posted here not to advocate for venomoids so much as to correct false information about them.

I note that a noisy poster here, alleging to be a vet surgeon has NOT answered my simple questions about their own expertise on venomoids. On that basis, it would be fair to assume they have none. On the same basis, I assert the same person has a greater ability to make noise, than as a vet surgeon and I for one would never send a sick animal of any kind their way!

I also refer to an earlier post, where it was pointed out that it is now illegal to use snakes with venom glands intact in our legal domain (Victoria) and has been since June 2005.

That Snakehandler chose to operate in breach of the OH and S Act is his business, not ours. We will not put people at risk, even if they choose to do so. If Snakehandler have in fact changed their displays and stopped doing snake displays with venomous snakes in recent times in order to comply with the OH and S Act, by all means let everyone know.

I’d also draw his (or her) attention to the fact that a wildlife licence does not remove an obligation to comply with other state laws as stated in an earlier post, regardless of alleged training. In fact this is stated explicitly on the permits themselves! Furthermore, you seem misguided in thinking ignorance is a defence for breaking the law. In Australia it is not!

Finally, I should note that a failure here to answer or reply to posts should not be interpreted as a concession of any form on my part.

Our business, Snakebusters are regarded as Australia’s best reptiles education and are therefore in constant demand by educators and others. We also have other important activities in terms of conservation and research that are ongoing.

Most people see beyond lies and misinformation by inexperienced imitators that are unable to match our standards as identified by measurable criteria such as safety record, no staff ever hospitalized for snakebites in any circumstances, longer experience than all others, the only safety protocol to remove venomous snake bite risks, an unmatched record of widely cited scientific publications spanning three decades, citation of owner and staff as experts in all contemporary major texts on Australian reptiles and so on. We devote our limited time and resources where we think there is greatest public benefit and that is not necessarily rebutting false claims on internet chat forums and hate sites made by people with no recognized expertise in the subject matter.

Yours Faithfully

Snake Man


FUNK STATEMENT VENOMOID SNAKES

http://www.smuggled.com/Funk1.pdf
 
Old 10-26-2012, 09:10 PM   #176
Fangthane
Quote:
Originally Posted by adder
It is established fact that you have breached various rules and regulations and have induced others to do so. That you have not been prosecuted and penalized for these is scandalous. Furthermore you have publicly boasted of your own breaching of wildlife laws in writing!
Once again, you are asked to cease and desist from any bootlegging or tarnishing of our IP!

Now turning to some of the other noisy posters here, the Wikipedia hate page about me has no credibility whatsoever. You should also be aware that it is blocked from amendment and corrections.
Speaking of "no credibility": You'd know all about boasting and breaching wildlife laws. Pot, meet kettle. You make this too easy. According to the Herald Sun, that Wikipedia entry is spot on. I suppose they're out to get you, too, right?

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/vic...-1226111929548
Quote:
A SNAKE handler has been slammed after letting normally deadly snakes bite his 10-year-old daughter to prove they are de-venomised and safe.
It was also referenced in a later article:

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/vic...-1226300329360

Quote:
The reptile enthusiast also had his licence suspended last year after his daughter asked him to let a de-venomised snake bite her.
I'm sure it was all the daughter's idea..
Quote:
A SNAKE handler has had his license revoked after government authorities deemed his public demonstrations too dangerous, despite having a perfect safety record.
This also confirms that you did in fact suffer legal consequences from your displays. So, enlighten us, what part of that Wiki entry is false?
 
Old 10-27-2012, 04:39 AM   #177
Snakehandler
Yet again you misrepresent the truth, in 2011 you're attempt at an intervention order was dismissed, mine against you upheld, you appealed and both were dismissed. I stated in court I never created hate sites, none of my associates have intervention orders, although I understand you have several on people and I believe some on yourself!

You accused me in court of a vast array of things from stalking, attacking, stealing, and damaging property, which was denied under oath and you failed to present any evidence to contradict this.

The court found that neither of us has grounds for an AVO, you then attempted to drag me back into court on more lies and failed again

As you were told in court a letter from you is not a cease and desist, I don't use your trademarks, you claim people attempt to divert web traffic so why do you own snakehandlermelbourne.com.au? Remarkably similar to Snakehandler.com.au isn't it?

I have never been charged with anything, never convicted of anything, never questioned about criminal activity, had my permits revoked, suspended or limited! You continue to accuse me of crimes, yet you are not a wildlife officer, police officer or any other legal entity, you claim I stalk you, so why is it you have collected all this 'evidence' sought me out on forums and attempted in vain to discredit me......am I too successful and really a financial threat to yourself.....if I am so inferior to you why are you so concerned about what I do?
 
Old 10-28-2012, 08:37 PM   #178
adder
Dear Mr McCarthy, your rant above is beneath contempt.
Firstly, I have been known as a snake handler for decades preceding your lurching into the snake business in 2005.
You have no claim on the generic term!
I note that your predecessor in owning your business “Snakehandler” was a party to the illegal bootlegging of my Snakebuster trademark in 2004 and in terms of that breach, we were paid $30,000 damages.
Simon Watharow ( the previous owner of your business) and yourself have used the business name “snakehandler” as a deceptively similar hybrid of our two registered trademarks “snake man” and “snake buster”, thereby creating a deliberate confusion in the marketplace in a bid to snare some of our customers. You have gone further and defamed us to our established clients.
Your predecessor’s registration of an internet domain snakehandler, did not give you any exclusive right over the word (confirmed by the trademarks office more recently), and ourselves registered the internet domain “snakehandlermelbourne” because that is exactly what we do in business!

Noting your weapon of choice against snakes is metal tongs and we do not use these barbaric devices, it would have been more appropriate for you to register the domain “wekillsnakeswithtongs” rather than to continue to use the deceptive “snakehandler”, which at best only appears to have a passing likeness to your preferred activities.
In terms of your accounts of legal proceedings and claims against me, you are wrong or misleadingly deceptive in all major particulars, including repeatedly claiming I am a liar.
The liar on this forum is you!
Fact is we have three intervention orders in force against associates of yours at the present time to prevent repeats of past criminal actions by them!
In the Magistrates court last year, the magistrate Clifford, found against me because he sought revenge for several adverse mentions in my books “Victoria Police Corruption” from the 1990’s.
You had no evidence against me and the fact is that a previous magistrate had found against you to place an intervention order on you in the first instance and it was you who brought the contest to this magistrate previously shown to be corrupt.
That Clifford was in error was confirmed when the higher court judge overturned his decision this year and removed your order on me.
We have never stalked or harassed your business and lack both time and inclination to do so, but the fact is you have done so to us including on numerous hate sites.
Fact is, you came onto this forum to attack me, I did not come here to attack you. The historical record of this thread, which I have copied, shows this!
Fact is, we have a statement from a former employee of yours detailing your unlawful campaign against our business. We also have other statements and evidence, including your own posts on various sites and hate forums.
Fact is that by all measurable criteria, our business is the best at what we do in Australia and that is why in a rare move, we were granted the legally exclusive right to market ourselves as Australia’s best reptiles shows by the trademarks office.
See detail here:
http://www.snakebusters.com.au/austr...t-reptiles.htm
You may not like being second best, tenth best or whatever, but you are stuck with it.
Fact is also that you have bootlegged our registered trademarks to try to gain customers. You are not the only business to have done so. By law we must protect our trademarks and to that extent, myself, my staff and my lawyers monitor infringers activity that may include further breaches, as we are legally obliged to and so we may act appropriately as the need arises. We would prefer people like yourself acted within the law, but this is clearly not your past history and your posts here indicate a likelihood you lack remorse and are likely to reoffend.
You personally, are probably not a threat to our activity, save for when you send people to our displays to disrupt them. However what you induce others to do, including your associates within the Victorian Wildlife Department, clearly is a threat to us, as seen by the unlawful closures of our business twice in the last two years on false pretexts and following your direct representations to them which you have admitted in court.
You are already aware that twice, Victorian courts have found the closures of our vital education business to have been unlawful and as of this date, there is a legally binding court order preventing the government from closing us down.
Noting that public safety would be at risk with our closure, the current situation of us continuing to trade makes sense.
You Mr McCarthy have made yourself a major part of the problems facing wildlife and conservation in today’s rapidly changing world. It would be nice if you could apologise for your actions to date and choose instead through further actions that you can become part of the solutions to the problems instead.
Yours Faithfully.
 
Old 10-28-2012, 10:12 PM   #179
Snakehandler
Mr. Hoser,

Again you misrepresent the truth.

What Mr. Watherow did or did not do is of no consequence to me or the current ownership of Snakehandler Pty Ltd, there has been no attack by myself on you, simply the statement that it is illegal to demonstrate venomous snakes in Victoria under any legislation provided you have the appropriate permits.....which I have.

The discussion here is is it right or wrong to venomoid snakes, now since you completed you procedures there has been a change in the law, outlawing this process as it has no medical benefit to the animal. Just like docking the tail of a dog or declawing a cat. It cannot be done in Australia, not by you, a vet or any other person.

Any other issues raised have been by yourself.

No associate, friend or employee of mine has an AVO on them. The people who you have sought out through the courts have NO association with me personally.......Facebook hardly equates to friendships or associates, simply people who have similar interests.....most of these people have liked my snakehandler fan page, just like you have people who have liked your page and I have NO control on them. I have no associates in any wildlife department, if you are not stalking me why did you front to court with two A4 binders of 'evidence' dating back to 2005 when I purchased the business. You have been collecting every word printed that mentions my name, my business name or anything you believe is published by me.....this is stalking

I have never asked anyone to do anything illegal, and in all the court proceedings you have brought forth, you have never been able to link them to me......as the Judge in the County Court said to you this year in July....just because you say it's so doesn't make it so.

I am still opposed to venomoids, I still comply with every section of legislation and work towards making people more aware of safety around wildlife. No snake handled by me has ever died, we teach the use of tongs for the purpose of snake catching on RUBBER SNAKES (again you will claim to have a statement from someone who has done our training......just because you say its so doesnt make it so) as it is a technique that although not everyone agrees with is legally permitted, if trained correctly enables the safe handling of snakes without having to make physical contact by human hand, and yes old style tongs did cause damage, they have never been used by my company, Midwest have produced a set of tongs known as Gentle Giants, specifically designed for handling venomous snakes, under the Coal mine health and safety act (QLD), the Mining and Quarrying safety act (QLD) and the occupational health and safety act it is my duty to enable people to use a variety of techniques to suit a given situation. In most cases the companies that I work with would prefer to use hands off techniques where possible, we on the other hand prefer people to learn to hook or tail snakes.

I have NEVER made statements that would affect your permits, I have actually refused to be part of it when asked if I could provide names of people you have had dealings with that have asked me where to complain to.....I simply do not want to be associated with any legal case involving you...remember you dragged me into court.....not the other way around.

I have a very successful business, if its second to you I don't care.....I wasn't aware of any publicly available opinion poll on who is best and wouldn't worry myself with it anyhow....I have more than enough business to make my life very comfortable......competition is good, it keeps most people attentive to their own business practices where they attempt to be better every day rather than put others down.

Once again the procedure of venomoiding a snake in Australia is NOW illegal, the OH&S act cannot endorse an illegal practice, hence your statement that it is now illegal to demonstrate venomous snakes unless they have been venomoided is incorrect. As to whether its right or wrong in other respects, morally and ethically I find it wrong, disgusting and unnecessary......we would never do it, never want them or ever consciously work with surgically altered snakes
 
Old 10-28-2012, 10:14 PM   #180
Snakehandler
Ps.....I too have trademarks http://pericles.ipaustralia.gov.au/atmoss/Falcon.Result

Your domain name snakehandlermelbourne.com.au actually is similar to a registered trademark as as you like to point out, this MAY be a violation of Australian IP laws.
 

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