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Old 01-09-2019, 09:54 AM   #1
MorrigansWings
Antaresia Questions

Hello all!
I'm a reasonably new snake owner several months into owning a western hognose, who is doing awesome! I also recently bought a female Children's Python at an expo a few days ago. She looked to be in good health at the time, no mites and didn't seem too skinny. She never struck at me, but she did nuzzle and try to bite several times. I was assured that she would calm down with steady handling, and I wrote the behavior off to young snake nippiness.

On the drive home, I realized that I'd forgotten to ask how old she was - messaging the seller later, I was told that she is about a year and a half old. That surprised me for a number of reasons:

Visually, she's got a more defined pattern than many of the images of Children's Pythons I've seen online. I'd assumed it was an age thing, since it sounded like Children's and Spotted Pythons tend to look really similar when they're young, but if she's a year and a half, her coloration should have lightened and her spots gotten more diffuse by now, yes? I'll attach a pic for reference.

Temperament-wise, I'd heard that Antaresia pythons across the board tend to be really docile and inquisitive snakes, once they get out of the juvenile nippy stage. I would have thought she'd be out of that by a year and a half. That said, it could have been the increased stress between the expo and having just got her home (she tried the same thing while I was weighing her and getting her set up in quarantine). I also would have expected her to strike out of nerves, rather than the nuzzle-and-bite that she is doing...?

Size-wise, she seems small for her age. She weighs in at 51 grams, and the only size chart I can find clocks individuals in a clutch in at anywhere from 100g-250g at 12 months, much less at around 18 months. That said, I could only find the one chart - what's actually a good weight for a year-and-a-half old Antaresia python? If she is underweight, should I try and feed more like every 5 days (as long as she's defecated first) to help her put on weight, or stick to the every 7 I'd originally planned?

Thanks in advance for any and all help!
Attached Images
 
 
Old 01-09-2019, 10:18 AM   #2
bcr229
Nuzzle then nip sounds more like a food response (hmmmmmmmm this smells like it might be edible, let's taste it and see) than defensiveness, which is usually a fast bite and retreat. Try putting something like lemon-scent hand sanitizer on your hands before picking her up to see if that stops the behavior; the sharp smell should turn off any food response.

I can't help with an appropriate size for her age, but do bear in mind that most snakes in captivity are overfed, and a slightly underweight snake is preferable to one that has been grown up quickly or allowed to get fat. Based on your picture I would say that the snake is fine, as it's square and not round so it's not been overfed, and the spine is not protruding so it's not underweight.
 
Old 01-09-2019, 11:20 AM   #3
Herpin Man
Although I don't work with Children's pythons, I do work with the closely related Stimson's python. Comparing the size of the snake to the size of the hands, I'd say that the snake is a pretty normal size for a year and a half old. I would feed that snake a weanling mouse once a week, if it were mine.
The nuzzle and bite could be a feeding bite, but it could also be a defensive bite. I have had the occasional Stimson's do the same thing, and milk snakes are notorious for this behavior. This isn't abnormal, considering the new housing and new person it is being exposed to. More than likely, it will settle down with time.
Regarding the pattern; at this point, the adult coloration should have mostly come in. That being the case, this appears to be a Spotted, rather than a Children's python. A photo of the parents should help confirm that one way or another.
 
Old 01-10-2019, 10:12 AM   #4
MorrigansWings
Thanks for the responses folks!
I'm not amazingly worried about temperament issues - I can work with her on anything like that. I was mostly just worried about the possible size issues / underfeeding, and whether the biting issues were a corroborating sign of something like that.
I'll give her some time to settle in and get a good few meals into her, then reassess

Quote:
Originally Posted by Herpin Man View Post
I would feed that snake a weanling mouse once a week, if it were mine.
I took a look at this site here for what you meant by weanlings: http://www.rodentpro.com/feeder-mice-guide.asp
Wouldn't a 13g-17g mouse be too big for her, given her weight? Given that she's only 51g, a 13g mouse would be about 25% of her body weight - I thought the rule of thumb was 10-15%? Or am I wrong about that?
 
Old 01-11-2019, 04:31 PM   #5
Herpin Man
No, it shouldn't be too big, but if you're hesitant, you could always go smaller and feed two at a time. However the smaller the mice, the higher the fat content. I am an advocate of feeding older rodents as soon as the snake is able to take them, for the nutritional advantage.
I also find that most "rule of thumb" feeding guidelines that are found online underestimate the size of prey item that a given herp species can eat. That's strictly my opinion, of course, but I tend to ignore things like that in favor of letting past experience be my guide.
 
Old 01-11-2019, 08:35 PM   #6
elena
I don't feel that is a pure Children's python. Nor does it look like a Stimpson's to me. I'd say it is either a spotted or one of the ubiquitous spotted x Children's hybrids.
 
Old 01-15-2019, 10:56 AM   #7
MorrigansWings
Quote:
Originally Posted by Herpin Man View Post
No, it shouldn't be too big, but if you're hesitant, you could always go smaller and feed two at a time. However the smaller the mice, the higher the fat content. I am an advocate of feeding older rodents as soon as the snake is able to take them, for the nutritional advantage.
I also find that most "rule of thumb" feeding guidelines that are found online underestimate the size of prey item that a given herp species can eat. That's strictly my opinion, of course, but I tend to ignore things like that in favor of letting past experience be my guide.
Fair enough I'll snag a couple of larger mice before her next meal and see what she'll take. She had 2 fuzzies on the 11th, so I have a bit of time to go get those.

Quote:
Originally Posted by elena
I don't feel that is a pure Children's python. Nor does it look like a Stimpson's to me. I'd say it is either a spotted or one of the ubiquitous spotted x Children's hybrids.
I did speak to the breeder and he said he has both spotteds and childrens, and this one's parents were definitely both childrens. *shrug*
Doesn't REALLY matter all that much I suppose, since I wasn't really planning on breeding her. Might have been nice in future, maybe, but if I can't be 100% sure which species she is (or if she's a hybrid), I likely won't.
 

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