OMG - has anyone else seen this ad?

Sorry, I didn't remember how to do a screen capture, and am quite pressed for time so I just copied the ad text, I will include the link to the ad: moderator, please feel free to delete this if inappropriate. if anyone can do the screen capture, great. the ad:

This is something I would almost never do, but I have been asked repeatedly whether or not I have any "less than perfect" animals for sale at reduced pricing. So, I have decided to allow a few animals out that I am confident are established, healthy and eating great.

I have a trio, 1.2 Albino Colombians, that have less than perfect eyes. The male has both eyes and both function, but look a little different. Female # 1 has one perfect eye, and Female 2 has no eyes. All three are very healthy, have no other issues and are coming along just as their siblings are. I kept these animals for a while to ensure they are as healthy (save for the eyes) as their littermates. And they are.

I am offering the trio for 1200.00 shipped and will include a health guarantee. I am confident enough in these animal's health that I will be offering a 3 month, money back guarantee to whom ever purchases them. I beleive these animals will be able to breed and flourish like any other albino available.


I am shocked that anyone is offering deformed babies (most likely littermates) and saying: go ahead and breed'em. AAGH!!

http://market.kingsnake.com/detail.php?cat=8&de=293847
forgot to include it - at least this way this whole piece can be removed if necessary

I didn't check the ad, but that is absolutly repugnant. Just sickening.

I think this should be placed on the BOI, so at least all of us who participate here, will know who not to buy from , even "healthy" looking animals, because you have no way of knowing if they came from any lines with genetic flaws. The fact that he has no problem selling these (at those prices and even mentions breeding them) shows that any time he breeds and gets defects he probably just seperates them out of the good ones and sells the rest, no doubt without mentioning anything about it.


ADDENDUM; Damn the ad is gone, if anybody saw who placed this ad please post an "is this an ethical breeder" or some type of BOI post. Or if you don't wanna do that please e-mail or PM me with the names so I can add them to my list. I would not want to purchase anything from such a person.
Thanks

It was Joel DuBay's ad. Ever heard of him? He's offering 3 albinos for the price of what a cheap one goes for and tells you everything that's wrong with them, why they're so cheap and that it's at the request of many people. If you don't like it, don't buy it. More importantly, don't whine about it.

I'm familiar with the name; but i don't know him personally, nor have I ever done business with him. nothing to say for or against...til that ad. I understand that he pointed everything out in the ad - not saying he was trying to pass them off as anything they were not. I even understand wanting to find them homes (even selling them to those homes) rather than euthanize them...after all, they are healthy, aside from their deformities. my concern is with the fact that he is essentially encouraging somebody to breed them. IMO, certain ethical standards should still apply to our breeding practices. As far as I know, it is not commonplace (yet) to neuter/spay reptiles (that is a common clause in NO BREED type contracts that mammal breeders offer with imperfect animals, along with limited registration). should that particular pair be bred again?? perhaps, as it is uncertain that it is a genetic defect at this point. but if it happens again, then what? the albino population hails from a very limited gene pool, with line breeding and inbreeding being commonplace. eventually, problems happen when a line gets crossed to often or the wrong way. regardless of the quality of Joel's stock, selling 1.2 deformed littermates, CHEAP, and stating that they will breed and flourish is essentially stating "buy'em, breed'em and see what happens". it might lead to healthy, strong baby albinos...then again, it might not. regardless, I think it is an idea/practice that would be frowned upon by many. if being shocked by seeing that in print makes me a whiner...waaaaaaaaaah

He's done this before and, if I recall correctly, he flat out denied that he that genetic defect in his line. I may be incorrect about him, I am terrible with names, but I think that was him.

Apparantly, Joel had "second thoughts" as well, since he pulled the ad almost immediately.

The "eye" issue with albinos has shown itself numerous times throughout various bloodlines. The main propblem with "SOME" albino bloodlines is that early on, some people were in such a hurry to produce, that they didn't bother out-crossing the lines to ensure healthy stock.

Unfortunately, it would seem that Joel was the recipient of some of these hurried animals and is now paying the price. If three of the babies in his litter, have these problems, guess what: the remaining animals in the litter have the same genetics.

Originally Posted by Mike Greathouse

Apparantly, Joel had "second thoughts" as well, since he pulled the ad almost immediately.

The "eye" issue with albinos has shown itself numerous times throughout various bloodlines. The main propblem with "SOME" albino bloodlines is that early on, some people were in such a hurry to produce, that they didn't bother out-crossing the lines to ensure healthy stock.

Unfortunately, it would seem that Joel was the recipient of some of these hurried animals and is now paying the price. If three of the babies in his litter, have these problems, guess what: the remaining animals in the litter have the same genetics.

I'm sure he'll re-post on some of the more obscure sites in the near future.

not if they're already sold, which is another possible reason for the ad being removed...though I certainly hope it is because he rethought things

When, oh when, are some of these yahoo reptile breeders going to learn to cull their stock? Are we all that greedy? If the bird trade, and especially the fish trade, did not cull stock and cross stock, where would we be? One eyed Macaws with no beaks??? Bichirs without fins????
People like that make me ill. The worst sort of breeder.

greg