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Old 04-03-2007, 08:07 AM   #81
Dachiu
Cheri :
In your last 5 posts on this thread alone - you have offered no referenceable information and no verifyable data.
You state that PCR with blood/swab can be done in multiple places. We all know this. This is not the question.

Again - this is NOT an attack, just a simple question that should have a simple answer ==

What lab/labs are using PCR as a testing method of identifying atadenovirus in bearded dragons utilizing blood and cloacal swabs as a medium?

Thank you.
 
Old 04-03-2007, 09:35 AM   #82
varnyard
Cheri Smith AKA CheriS, all I see is you making these claims without any proof at all and you have been doing this for months. Not just here, but everywhere, you, Chasity and Denise.

Chasity, had this so called proof to, she now has a thread on the BOI where it is proven she altered someones test results to make it look like she had clean dragons. She also made the same claim about getting PCR blood swab testing done.

Now Denise is the only other one to claim to have PCR blood swab testing done. No one can find one ounce of a shred of proof that any lab/vet/doctor is doing this test on this virus

What is so hard about backing up your statements up with proof?
 
Old 04-03-2007, 09:52 AM   #83
Cat_72
I see the topic list for the 2007 ARAV (Association of Reptile and Amphibian Veterinarians) conference includes several items relating to Adeno:

Quote:
The detection of adenovirus infections in bearded dragons (Pogona vitticeps) with real time PCR B. Wagner

Estimating the sensitivity and specificity of two different assays for bearded dragon adenovirus using latent exact modeling-Walden M

Development of a non-invasive diagnostic technique to characterize the adenoviral status of Australian bearded dragons (Pogona vitticeps)-S. Zimmerman
Perhaps this is finally getting enough attention.
 
Old 04-03-2007, 09:55 AM   #84
draggintails
I would also like to say from what I know personally talking to other vets, researchers, lab techs and lab managers, some of them are being treated incredibly brutal when called by some of those who do not want any dragons to be negative and grilled for information, very intrusive and feeling they are being accused of being shoddy or poor in their work and process or they have done something wrong and are being harassed.


I heard this too, so I asked Dr. Stacey (and everything I say is verifiable with that lab...pick up the phone before you eat me people). We discussed this Cheri and you mentioned a few times to me twice in person (once on Oct on the phone and once in March in person to me and Ken Robertson at the show) and in an email that the markers U of F is using could be incorrect and that you are suspicious of the high positives.....extremely important to me to bring this up with the lab....they are selling me a product which is their test and giving me a result...I won't have any funny business going on and when you tell me this, I absolutely have to research it. Please do not misunderstand me, I am no tattle tale but my husband is a lawyer, I was a legal secretary we don't even think about confirming things--just do it, it is the difference between a paycheck and losing in this house. With this it was the difference between life and death..literally.

Dr. Stacey said he had heard you said this before, your name was used so there was no misunderstanding and that is where the above quote is coming from, I don't want to hurt you Cheri I am very sorry, but he was referring to you in that quote. Now if he is referring to someone else as well I don't know.

The many negatives that are coming back,yeah right....I would like to purchase a few babies from negative PCR parents...I will need permission to verify test results with the lab and I will PCR the baby and he must come back neg. If you have babies that are neg for ATA 1. I will purchase some......this is no trick.

I am left with an itsy bitsy group of animals, as is everyone else that has tested , I am disgusted and I am out of options.

Now, I can't find one negative animal, I purchased a dozen from a dozen breeders and ALL were positive. I am tired of spending money. Please contact me if you have what I am looking for.
 
Old 04-03-2007, 10:46 AM   #85
Cat_72
Quote:
Originally Posted by varnyard
It could be compared to the Parvo virus, many dogs carry that virus without it affecting them.
I'm curious, where did you get this information? According to everything I have ever learned about Parvo, and my vet..this is simply NOT true. Many dogs carry the antibodies to fight parvo, but this comes from being immunized.

Quote:
Originally Posted by varnyard
Also, It is believed to be a very strong virus, it is recommended to kill it in a enclosure you must use a strong bleach solution. This could also be one reason it is so wide spread.
When I spoke to you on the phone, you insisted that the only thing that would kill adeno was cleaning with ammonia....and since most folks don't clean their enclosures with ammonia, that was part of the reason it was so widespread.

 
Old 04-03-2007, 10:54 AM   #86
shrap
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cat_72
When I spoke to you on the phone, you insisted that the only thing that would kill adeno was cleaning with ammonia....and since most folks don't clean their enclosures with ammonia, that was part of the reason it was so widespread.

He told me the only thing that would kill it is a 20 percent bleach solution. Which is it? What gives? Contradictory statements. Break out the torches and pitchforks. Hot tar, feathers. HE'S A WITCH!!!!!
 
Old 04-03-2007, 11:41 AM   #87
varnyard
Quote:
Cat_72, When I spoke to you on the phone, you insisted that the only thing that would kill adeno was cleaning with ammonia....and since most folks don't clean their enclosures with ammonia, that was part of the reason it was so widespread.
Cathy, this is where the problems come in. There are so many people giving information about this virus that is not backed up by facts. I was told ammonia, and told you the exact same thing.

Then I found the facts here:

Quote:
Vickie Dachiu: After researching through some materials that we have obtained - we came across some interesting information…

The MSDS for Adenovirus do list a disinfectant susceptibility to 1% sodium hypochlorite for 30 minutes. (Section IV) http://www.phac-aspc.gc.ca/msds-ftss/msds3e.html

Contrary to what we have been told by medical professionals about bleach -
We have a gallon of regular Clorox that lists 6% sodium hypochlorite as an active ingredient. If mixed with water at 20-25% Clorox - this should be sufficient (at 1.2-1.5%) to disinfect a cage and its accessories.

Any thoughts on this?

Quote:
Cat_72: I'm curious, where did you get this information? According to everything I have ever learned about Parvo, and my vet..this is simply NOT true. Many dogs carry the antibodies to fight parvo, but this comes from being immunized.
Cathy, I said:

Quote:
I am far from an expert, but I have been reading and learning about this virus. It is true, a dragon can live a healthy life and carry the virus. Some might be affected by it, but it is just way too early to have all of the facts.
IMO, It could be compared to the Parvo virus, many dogs carry that virus without it affecting them. Does it kill every dog? No, If it did dogs would be extinct.
This is why if people claim to have these unknown facts need to post proof of them.
 
Old 04-03-2007, 11:44 AM   #88
Dachiu
PLEASE NOTE :
California Avian Laboratory is a diagnostic and consultative support for avian/exotic veterinarians ONLY. It has been requested by them that no one contact them directly - but instead please have your veterinarian contact them with any questions on the testing methods available through their lab.


However, they do not offer atadenovirus testing for bearded dragons.
 
Old 04-03-2007, 11:54 AM   #89
Cat_72
Quote:
Originally Posted by varnyard
Cathy, this is where the problems come in. There are so many people giving information about this virus that is not backed up by facts. I was told ammonia, and told you the exact same thing.

Then I found the facts here:






Cathy, I said:



This is why if people claim to have these unknown facts need to post proof of them.
Bobby...my whole point was that you are pointing out so many little inconsistancies that you view as proof positive that someone is lying.....yet they are not the only ones showing that inconsistancy. Honest mistakes are made.....but saying completely untrue things like, "many dogs carry parvo and are unaffected by it" to use as a comparison can be very misleading, purposely or not.
 
Old 04-03-2007, 12:05 PM   #90
varnyard
Cathy, you are correct, however if someone has the proof that this testing has been done and could help this hobby by posting that proof, then why is it such a secret?

This is the only problem I really have with this picture. To make the claim to be the only one of two that had clean tests on this virus, IMO needs to be backed up with facts.

One of them was already caught not having proof of this test, or virus free dragons.

If I am so wrong, then someone can feel free to prove that by posting the proof. I will admit I was wrong, I will post it everywhere I have been with this, but it requires proof.
 

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