BallBids.com?

Originally Posted by wwmjkd

in case no one else has previously posted it, I believe most of what Wes alludes to is the information from this thread.

http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...1-Ballbids.com

That is correct. I meant to include the link but forgot it.

Originally Posted by Wilomn

That is correct. I meant to include the link but forgot it.

Gotcha. I hadn't seen any of that. It makes more sense now, lol.

Well...I guess I feel the same way about this as I do about ANY of the same type of auction sites. It's not a lot different than walking into a casino, throwing 20 bucks into a machine, and hoping you hit it big. I don't think calling it a "scam" is really appropriate, but I can see where folks could look at it that way if the don't understand the whole process.

The quarantine is what would disturb me. If the snakes are indeed all coming from ONE breeder, Mike Wilbanks, perhaps not so much...but if the time were to come where there were more suppliers, it would be a BIG issue.

I also agree that the original banner for the site, showing what appears to be snakes sold for certain prices, was a poor judgement call at best...misleading may be more accurate.

Just out of geniune curiousity - if it had been Mr. Wilbanks himself that had set up the auction on his site, would folks look at it differently?

I talked to mike Wilbanks and he confirmed selling snakes to them. However, he is not affiliated with the site and does not endorse the site.

Hi everyone!

My name is Avi Cohen, and I'm a Co-owner of BallBids.com I'm not sure who it was that emailed me and invited me to this thread, but thank you for the invite!

I'm here in case anyone has any uncertainties or questions they'd like to ask.

Originally Posted by Lucille

Their ads list 'sold' prices, but the site itself has info saying 'there are no winners yet'.
Makes one wonder.

Hi Lucille!

Please, allow me to copy-paste one of my previous responses from Ball-pythons.net:

"My job at BallBids.com is to direct all of the company's digital marketing efforts. I developed the banner ads that you've being seeing, so i apologize for giving you a negative impression. Part of my banner development involves seeing what my competition has tested, and considering companies like Quibids and BidCactus have millions of dollars to test different ad variations, it was already proven that those ads would be effective at building our user base.

Again, I apologize for giving you a bad impression. Seeing as how we're a brand new website, it's obvious that no auctions have been completed yet. Instead, the ads were intended to give visitors an idea of the possibilities."

Originally Posted by twgrosmick

Its a new idea that many websites are using. You pay for the amount of bids which is how they make their money, and the bid increases by a penny each bid. Great deal if you are the last few bids and win it, but could be a huge loss if you dumb 100 bids @$65.00 I believe and then are not able to win. In the last few minutes every time someone bids the time increases back to say 5 min until it goes 5 min without anyone bidding.
Hope this helped

Tyler

Hi twgrosmick!

You've mostly got our system down, thank you! Just to clarify, the timer on all of our auctions will go down until it drops below 15 seconds, at which point any bids will rest the timer back to 15 seconds, never higher. I'll copy-paste another bit I mentioned on another forum:

"As for the timer resetting to 15 seconds, there is a certain level of uncertainty that comes with the system being set up this way (Which is necessary). If it weren't for this system, sniper bidders would dominate our website, leaving only a handful of winners. Instead, all bidders need to gauge whether or not competing bidders will give in sooner rather than later, which creates that necessary uncertainty and prevents our site from becoming a breeding ground for snipers."

Auction prices are capped at 25% the item/animal's value, that way the final auction price will always be 75% the regular price, and, at the same time, 5% of the value of all bid package purchases are given back right away in the form of Reward Points that can be redeemed for other gifts and prizes at our Reward Store.

Originally Posted by redhood23

I used to live in coral springs and was always into reptiles and knew lots of people there. I will ask around and see if I can find any info on these guys

Hi redhood23!

I just moved up to Louisville, Kentucky from Coral Springs about 2 weeks ago! Which area did you live in? I lived off of Coral Hills, right behind the City Hall!

Originally Posted by Will0W783

It does sound a bit weird- also it looks like they only have two auctions going on. One for a butter ball female and one for a package of bids. That seems kind of fishy...where are all these snakes they are saying they have for auction?

Hi Will0W783!

Because we're a new website, we're focusing mainly on building our user base, that way we don't put ourselves out of business right from the start. Once our user base justifies the listing of multiple auctions, you will see just that!

Also, we keep all of our snakes in a melamine rack system we built here at out facility. We've got a sub-adult rack and a hatchling rack at the moment, fully equipped with thermostats, heat tape, hide boxes, water bowls, etc. Once we are done building the rest of our racks we will have enough room to house 105 snakes, for the time being.

I hope that answers your questions!

Originally Posted by dchristensen

The way their system works, you buy 100 bids for $65. Then you start bidding.

At the end, each bid in the last 15 seconds extends the clock by 15 seconds, so it can go on forever or until everyone runs out of bids to use. So, if someone wants the snake more than me, but only has 30 bids they run through them faster than I do and I keep bidding until I win.

If 2000 people bid at the $0.65 per bid, the site nets $1,300 for the auction and sells the snake for 25% of the list. The butter they have now is at $350 value so a total price for the winner of $87.50. In the end, they buy a snake from Mike Wilbanks for $350, auction it for $87.50 and net $1,000 from the deal.

It makes sense for them and if you win the auction, you get a Wilbanks butter for cheap. I guess the real question is whether Mike Wilbanks likes them using his snakes and authorized them to use his name?

Hi dchristensen!

Please reference my above response to "twgrosmick" to clarify how our system works.

As for Mike Wilbanks, he is aware of what we have going on, but he is NOT affiliated with us in any way besides being our primary source for ball pythons.

And as for using his company's name, we're simply developing his brand some more, as a thank you for helping us out with prices when we purchased snakes in bulk. At the same time, people need to know where their animals are coming from, and how can you go wrong with Constrictors Unlimited?

Originally Posted by SafariPets

great description Dale...
I was assuming Mike Wilbanks is part of it/ has partnered with them... I guess I shouldn't assume anything, they are using his logo...

He's NOT affiliated with us in any way, besides being our primary source for ball pythons. I apologize for any confusion.

-Avi =)

I too find this very fishy. The fact that I saw one of their banners stating they sold a Sunset Ball (a so far one of a kind, non-genetic snake owned by BHB), was enough for me to call their BS. I would never bid on a site like that, it just looks way to phoney and is as stated before built on lies. If you're built on lies, where do you go from there?

Originally Posted by aviBallBids

Seeing as how we're a brand new website, it's obvious that no auctions have been completed yet. Instead, the ads were intended to give visitors an idea of the possibilities."

It was not obvious. You advertised the snakes as 'sold'. I'd pull those banners pronto, starting off by lying is not a good start.

Avi, if you've never completed an auction, how can you have a banner that says you did? It's not good business. I have several dinker projects in my collection (African Fat-Tails), and I would never say they are genetic unless they are. Same concept applies here, how can you say something has sold for X amount when it is a snake there is one of in the world that only one breeder has?

I got an unsolicited email from them the other day, and deleted it without looking too far into it.

I'm not a big fan of people who harvest my email address, then spam me to promote their business. I'm perfectly capable of finding legitimate people to do business with, on my own.

It's a site not worth visiting.
The only people who will get a good deal are the owners. They are going to make money by charging for bids.
Resetting the clock allows them to collect more money NOT keep out robo-bidders.
They started by marketing lies and eventually they will be out of business.
I hope NO ONE falls for this trap.

Looking at other sites that run similar auctions it appears the business model they are running appears to be perfectly legal, as long as it is legit. I just don't know how to determine they are legit until actual winners come forward that have reputations established elsewhere in the community. From my dealings with most reputable people in the hobby, I can't see any of them being insane enough to gamble like that, or put their reputation on the line like that. Most people in the hobby are not making enough money to go throw money at the chance of winning something.

Other types of auction sites use this model and have become very profitable selling other stuff. Problem is, for every satisfied bidder you have hundreds if not thousands of unsatisfied bidders. I don't think it will take them long to disenfranchise a lot of the group they are calling their client base.