Help Identifying my Leo's

Originally Posted by manning0621

I understand where the both of you are coming from. What I want you to understand is I know what they are and I did before I bred them. It is hard to tell with my mack because I have seen both normals and mack snows that look like her and I know the only way to prove her is by breeding. When I first posted it came off that I had no clue. The intention of the post was more so to double check on others opinions. If I felt it irresponsible I would have never paired the 2 together. When I planned on breeding them I know what I was expecting to get. Jelly I did use that site well before I ever bred the two. Also I would like to say thanks to jelly for the input

Whether it's Mack or not is no big deal. It's a co dom gene so it's either a snow or not. Not knowing what type of an albino is. Your albino could be a tremper and your Mack could be het bell. Different albino strains should never be paired up. That's basically what we've been trying to explain. The gene pool is messed up enough already.

Well if its that easy and that's all you wanted to tell me all along you could have said so in the words you just put them in, instead of saying breeding with unknown genetics is unethical. I understand your concern from a breeder point of view and some breeders take generations to breed out an unwanted gene but even we as hobbiests and also the breeders can never be for sure of the gene pool they are coming from. Yes you have the persons word and yes you believe you can always trust someone but in a world were you can actually strip down the DNA to every gecko you breed it is completley impossible. By posting what I did it was in an effort to move away from this and actually thank jelly for the comment. I'm not looking to start this back up because I've done my research and I came to this site in hopes of a actual breeder helping me confirm my thoughts to put my mind at ease. I clearly stated yes I made a mistake and the post made it seem like I never tried but I had months of looking not only by me but my wife as well and a local breeders help.

But I will say thanks once again for responding and making it a little more clear.

I have tried to be helpful. You just don't like my answers.

I won't reply again unless you have a specific question for me.

I'm no breeder by any means, but I know mixing albino strains is a no no. I would never even entertain the idea as I don't wish to create unhealthy or murky gene pools, but could someone tell me what WOULD or COULD happen if they crossed?

a great deal of shunning, no respect whatsoever from the rest of the community, and a world of pain from other gecko breeders ;-)

Physiologically speaking - - and I cannot believe that I'm saying this out loud, it's doubtful that anything will really happen. I won't say that it NEVER could, because from a genomics standpoint, too many homozygous recessives thrown together can definitely cause some kind of issue in many species, but in leopard geckos, that hasn't been seen as of yet.

No serious breeders will ever buy your geckos if you mix them up like that, that's the big thing. If you're only breeding to have pets, do whatever you want - but - I'm going to go out on a limb and say that once you get 12 eggs out of a female and they all hatch and surprise, you have 12 "muddy" geckos. They may turn out to be beautiful, who knows - but you're PROBABLY going to want to sell a few of them. And no reasonable person with any desire to breed is going to buy them, case closed.

Dude (Evan and Craig, both of you) - just...don't do it. Leave it alone. Buy geckos from quality breeders so you know what you're getting (Kristi is one of them, for sure) - and if you want to breed those, make sure what you're breeding doesn't muddy the genetic waters even more on the ONSIDE chance you ever want to sell them again.

Kristi, I like your answers, don't feel bad <3

...this guy sums it up pretty well, by the way: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NUWJ8tbfWR0

Give it a gander.

OK all I want to say to that is go and take a gander at another post I made in the he ko discussions. The baby you see on this post is absolutely beautiful and completely healthy.

I never said the baby wasn't healthy, nor pretty - - - I'm just saying nobody (in their right mind with any aspirations toward ethical breeding) is going to buy it because of it's unclear lineage. The baby looks great, I never said it didn't.

I'm with Kristi, I will not respond again unless you ask me a specific question :-)

Good luck with the little one.

To both Kristi and Jelly. I want to give my apologies for jumping at you when you were trying to help. I understand mixing strain of albinos now is unhealthy by any breeders stand point of view. From what I can tell and know right now is I have bred a mack snow and tremper albino together and their hatchling has produced a normal het tremper. I do realize and know I still have plenty of things to learn and trust me I am researching everyday for a few hours to grasp the general concept of breeding terms and their genetics.

I do not want to receive a bad name on fauna due to one day I do have a real desire to become a breeder and grow in this ever evolving hobby. But my one real question is I was told by the pet store/breeder I bought my snow from that she is indeed a mack snow. Is the only real way of finding that out for sure breeding them until I actually have a proven snow or will that chance be very minimal. Thanks for any help.

Yes I am asking for both of your help lol

If she is a Mack, approx half the babies would be Mack. No telling if the Mack is het for anything though.

Stephanie, just to clarify... My project animals are from Steve Sykes and other already reputable breeders. I have plenty of room for my pets though which will never be sold.

I know their genetics 100%. No worries.