Outside enclosure for pit vipers

You should check out the outdoor enclosures Bert Langerwerf built at his facility. There was a good article on how he builds them in a reptile publication a few years ago, I don't remember which but it was probably either reptiles or Vivarium.
His enclosures wouldn't be exactly what you are wanting, but some of his methods might be useful for you. You'll have to consider things like drainage. You don't want rain water to collect inside during heavy periods of rainfall, but you also want the drainage to not provide an avenue of escape either.
Speaking of escape, while admittedly difficult, the possibility does exist that a large timber rattler could escape an open topped enclosure with a 48" wall.
Cinder blocks do offer limited purchase. While they couldn't scale them to a great height, I would say they could manage it for a little ways. A large specimen orienting himself in a corner only needs to get his chin above the edge of the wall to get the leverage to get out.

I also think a door would increase your own safety when entering and exiting the pit. A slight stumble on landing when getting over the wall could leave you on your back amidst 15 venomous snakes.

Originally Posted by Clay Davenport

I also think a door would increase your own safety when entering and exiting the pit. A slight stumble on landing when getting over the wall could leave you on your back amidst 15 venomous snakes.

That's an aspect that bothered me a bit when I first read the thread- the number of animals. Handling and interaction would obviously be kept pretty well to a minimum regardless, but on occassions when someone has to enter a large enclosure like the one described to interact with the animals, be it feeding or heath inspections- the attention of the handler would be split. The more animals, the more it becomes an uneccessary risk. While manipulating animal A, and keeping an eye on animal B and C what were using the same ground cover and remembering that animal D was spotted over in one corner five feet away and animal E was over by the wall where you came in you've still potentially got 10+ unaccounted for. The more animals involved, the lower the ability of the keeper to control the interaction and, in a captive situation and an enclosed space, even a largeish one, anything more than a few starts to very quickly look like it has the potantial for negative and costly mistakes.

Originally Posted by Seamus Haley

While manipulating animal A, and keeping an eye on animal B and C what were using the same ground cover

Me fail english? That's umpossible!

I agree completely Seamus. I just didn't elaborate on that aspect. I assumed since he was contemplating the setup those risks were accepted. Things like removing a snake from the pit, even when bagged, would be significantly more difficult when climbing the wall was required.

It does bring to mind an enclosure I saw at some zoo or another. It was 6 or 7 feet tall, by 6 or 7 feet wide, and about 3 feet deep. Fully furnished with many plants, branches, and vines.
In the cage I counted 6 adult green mambas, and there could have easily been more that blended in so well I missed them. All I could think while observing the enclosure was I'd sure hate to be the one who had to clean that cage.

In the pit suggested I'd probably consider adding elevated walkways in such a fashion that they would not provide a means over the wall for the snakes but they would keep me above them more to help minimize the risks while I searched out a particular individual I was looking for.

i have thought about the door issue. there are advantages and disadvantages to either system. i just see the door-less option as more secure. one of the alterations i have already decided on is to expand the size to 30 x 30. so in a 30 x 30 i will have a perimeter of about 120 feet. with no more snakes then i plan to house, there will be plenty of area with no snakes when its necessary to hope in. where i am moving is a very sandy soil, thus the name, Sand Mtn. It does not hold water very well at all. i know people who attempted to build a pond and couldn't. I think it would take Noah's flood to be a problem in a 30 x 30 set up. i have never seen any pit viper that could climb worth a flip. i am not too worried about any making it over the wall, but 2 things on that point. 1 if they are big enough to scale a 4 foot wall, someone (maybe me) is going to want that snake immediately, so it will never go into purgatory. it will go into my building or someone's. and 2, i am only going to house snakes from that region in there....so if by some act God or ill luck one makes it out, he is just going right back where he came from. Nothing like the mambas that Andrew was suppose to have scattered all over south FL.



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Samuel 'Chuck' Hurd
Professional Educator / Venomous Reptile Curator
www.ChuckHurd.com
423.580.7513 (txt capable)

you're not planning on considering these "part of a collection" are you? more or less, it's going to be like mr. haas' setup in florida, isn't it?

i was under the impression that it would kind of be self sustaining except that you'd give them food since hunting would be limited.

either way, i'd love to see it. you could put a horseshoe pit in it and call it the most dangerous game of horseshoes in the world and maybe make it on the late show

Hey Ricky, you are right on the money. The snakes kept outdoors will not be considered part of "my" collection. I want to keep them as close to wild as possible but still in a controlled environment where they can be found when needed. when all phases of this project are completed, i will be tagging these snakes with the electronic ID chip. we can scan them and know immediately exactly where they came from and the date they came out of the wild. If for some reason we ever needed to, we can return these snakes back to the wild and we will be returning the off spring back to areas near where they come from, but far enough away to limit human contact. i am several years away from completion, but this is an ideal project for that swamp you and i were talking about. If someone could get something like this up and going immediately, we could stock it with cottons from that swamp that is drying up and then populate those more isolated swamps with babies. in 2003, i saw 3 to 4 cottons every time i went to Wheeler, last 3 times i have taken someone there to show it off, we have not seen 1 snake, cotton or otherwise. i hate to see that. more people that claim to love these animals need to get active in making sure they survive outside of the slide racks.


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Samuel 'Chuck' Hurd
Professional Educator / Venomous Reptile Curator
www.ChuckHurd.com
423.580.7513 (txt capable)

Originally Posted by ChuckHurd

If for some reason we ever needed to, we can return these snakes back to the wild and we will be returning the off spring back to areas near where they come from, but far enough away to limit human contact. i am several years away from completion, but this is an ideal project for that swamp you and i were talking about. If someone could get something like this up and going immediately, we could stock it with cottons from that swamp that is drying up and then populate those more isolated swamps with babies.

Without looking for the specific state laws, that's probably illegal... definitely illegal most places.

Originally Posted by Seamus Haley

Without looking for the specific state laws, that's probably illegal... definitely illegal most places.

it's not.

we are not talking about releasing snakes held in captivity into the wild?