About the Good Guy Certification Program

Originally Posted by HighVoltageRoyals

I have a proposal! Maybe you can select volunteers to handle the auditing side and report which polls to delete based off of what they find?

Speaking as a GG Certificate holder, I really do like this program and would hate to see it get cut. I'm throwing my volunteer hat into the ring to audit because I really feel like this is an effective program.

Sorry if I may seem hard headed, but how exactly does that address the fact that the system itself has FAILED because so many participants have obviously abandoned it? The script my programmer put in place already shows me which ones need to be deleted with the yellow highlighting. That is the POINT of this thread. Sorry if I am missing something obvious, as this has been a rather trying day.

Originally Posted by WebSlave

Sorry if I may seem hard headed, but how exactly does that address the fact that the system itself has FAILED because so many participants have obviously abandoned it? The script my programmer put in place already shows me which ones need to be deleted with the yellow highlighting. That is the POINT of this thread. Sorry if I am missing something obvious, as this has been a rather trying day.

I am not so sure the system itself has failed. I did a random check of a few in yellow and one is actually a contributor. TheFragginDragon
Some (a lot) haven't logged in in years.
If you look, most of the newer ones are current & the ones that have lapsed are really old posts/cert #s.

I do however, see your point. You spent a lot of time on this and if people aren't going to notify you that they are no longer in the business or no longer want to participate, then why bother.

The issue is also, that too much time goes by between checks, so that the number of violators is overwhelming. Some in red, no longer have a good guy rating.

I see so many new members that are trying to get to the point of being able to apply and it would be a shame to forfeit this program based on so many factors, one of which is a mod issue.

Maybe based on the feedback you receive here, you will reconsider your decision and give it another chance. Maybe pick a few volunteers to clean it up and notify the few active users that they are in violation.

Crap, I was finished with my post, and my computer shut down. I'll try to recreate it...


Rich,
I understand that the GGC program is labor intensive to maintain; and if THAT is the reason you are pulling the plug, I won't argue - we can do the audits, and make the contacts, but you are the one that has to set them up and delete them (the latter also involves removing the certificate, which I'm guessing means disabling the code).
If, however, you are pointing to expired certificates meaning that the program has failed, I'll disagree. A portion of those people became paid members just to get their certificates, and likely never thought about the connection again. A fairly large group, as has been stated, is no longer active on this site. It happens - whether their interest has waned, they've chosen another site, or simply decided they were spending too darn much time on the computer - and it doesn't point toward the GGC program being a failure any more than their absence indicates that this site is a failure.
Some of the ones that are still active may renew, once it is brought to their attention. Others will not. This is expected, IMO....think about how many people opt to become paid members, then never renew. We just hope that the number of new contributors balances out (or surpasses) the number of nonrenewals.

If you are willing to give this some time, I'll put together some basic criteria, get a few volunteers, and do an audit of the yellowed name. Then - and I think this part might be best coming from members of the moderation team - we can make contact with the active members that still have sites (we'll have to talk about the criteria for that - I know the last time I audited, there were members that didn't have regular sites, but had pages on other herp sites...not sure if it was reptilegeeks or iherp).

Obviously, if you are set on discontinuing the GGC program, pursuing this is pointless; and if you are willing to consider it up for review, we should probably toss around the information obtained in the audit before contacting people. You know how people will get if they renew, and you can the program anyway.

Originally Posted by Snake-Queen

I am not so sure the system itself has failed. I did a random check of a few in yellow and one is actually a contributor. TheFragginDragon
.

I think there's a disconnect with this one, the GGC was originally issued to my old username FragginDragon (before it was somehow corrupted and I had to have it changed). The GGC banner is still posted on my website, and I'm current with my membership, so I'm at a loss as to why it's showing up highlighted yellow.

Just to illustrate a point - the first yellowed name, and owner of the very first GGC
#0001 - SerpenCo - Rich Zuchowski (Rich Z)

Does your name being there represent a failure of the system, or is it simply a byproduct of your retirement from the snake business?

Take a look at #s 2, 3, and 4
Ken Harbart, Dennis Thomas, and Jay Owens
Last visits 1 yr, 2.5 yrs, and 6 months respectively

The next one is still active, and has a website,
The next two show last visits of 6 months and 2 yrs.

A small sampling, to be sure, but it seems to give some credence to the problem being attrition rather than failure.

*Edit* I just looked at the last yellowed entry...just activated a week ago. Maybe it slipped his mind. He doesn't have the certificate posted on his site, though.
Also, a the next batch of yellows seem to have been activated right around a year ago. I was going to suggest that perhaps those people just expired - and that may be the case - but I'm not sure that can be considered an accurate indicator.

Originally Posted by hhmoore

Just to illustrate a point - the first yellowed name, and owner of the very first GGC
#0001 - SerpenCo - Rich Zuchowski (Rich Z)

Does your name being there represent a failure of the system, or is it simply a byproduct of your retirement from the snake business?

I was curious about this as well. IMO calling the system a failure is a bit steep, if the system is being used by some for the reason it was created...I don't think it should be considered a failure. If it isn't living up to the expectations you were hoping for I understand your frustration but again, calling it a failure just seems steep.

Originally Posted by hhmoore

If you are willing to give this some time, I'll put together some basic criteria, get a few volunteers, and do an audit of the yellowed name. Then - and I think this part might be best coming from members of the moderation team - we can make contact with the active members that still have sites (we'll have to talk about the criteria for that - I know the last time I audited, there were members that didn't have regular sites, but had pages on other herp sites...not sure if it was reptilegeeks or iherp).

I am willing to help in that aspect. Easy enough to check names, when last active & banner on website

Originally Posted by TheFragginDragon

I think there's a disconnect with this one, the GGC was originally issued to my old username FragginDragon (before it was somehow corrupted and I had to have it changed). The GGC banner is still posted on my website, and I'm current with my membership, so I'm at a loss as to why it's showing up highlighted yellow.

Originally Posted by TheFragginDragon

I think there's a disconnect with this one, the GGC was originally issued to my old username FragginDragon (before it was somehow corrupted and I had to have it changed). The GGC banner is still posted on my website, and I'm current with my membership, so I'm at a loss as to why it's showing up highlighted yellow.

Although I didn't write the code, I'm sure the easiest algorithm would have been to simply take the member name and check to see whether it was in any of the paid membership groups. So if someone changes their member name and didn't notify me to change the entry in the GGC entry, then yes, that would cause this to happen. And no, it's not something I would have automatically done at a member name change.

Originally Posted by hhmoore

Just to illustrate a point - the first yellowed name, and owner of the very first GGC
#0001 - SerpenCo - Rich Zuchowski (Rich Z)

Does your name being there represent a failure of the system, or is it simply a byproduct of your retirement from the snake business?

Take a look at #s 2, 3, and 4
Ken Harbart, Dennis Thomas, and Jay Owens
Last visits 1 yr, 2.5 yrs, and 6 months respectively

The next one is still active, and has a website,
The next two show last visits of 6 months and 2 yrs.

A small sampling, to be sure, but it seems to give some credence to the problem being attrition rather than failure.

*Edit* I just looked at the last yellowed entry...just activated a week ago. Maybe it slipped his mind. He doesn't have the certificate posted on his site, though.
Also, a the next batch of yellows seem to have been activated right around a year ago. I was going to suggest that perhaps those people just expired - and that may be the case - but I'm not sure that can be considered an accurate indicator.

Points all well taken, and I won't even dwell on the issue of why my original mods just walked away from here without so much as an explanation.

Sorry, I'm still not out of that funk I fell into yesterday. I'm getting out of here and going over to the garage to kick my car.

Originally Posted by Snake-Queen

I am not so sure the system itself has failed. I did a random check of a few in yellow and one is actually a contributor. TheFragginDragon
Some (a lot) haven't logged in in years.
If you look, most of the newer ones are current & the ones that have lapsed are really old posts/cert #s.

I do however, see your point. You spent a lot of time on this and if people aren't going to notify you that they are no longer in the business or no longer want to participate, then why bother.

The issue is also, that too much time goes by between checks, so that the number of violators is overwhelming. Some in red, no longer have a good guy rating.

I see so many new members that are trying to get to the point of being able to apply and it would be a shame to forfeit this program based on so many factors, one of which is a mod issue.

Maybe based on the feedback you receive here, you will reconsider your decision and give it another chance. Maybe pick a few volunteers to clean it up and notify the few active users that they are in violation.

Took the words right out of my mouth! Thanks for laying it all out like that!