Introduction and experiences with PTS's

Hey folks! I recently made my first post on this forum and have been reading avidly today... so I thought I'd introduce myself and list some of my experiences with Prehensile Tailed Skinks.

My name is Lisa, and I've been a herper for about 8 years. I breed leopard geckos (for local sales only, lots of fun), and I own a Rough Green Snake, a Ball Python, a Bearded Dragon, and two Prehensiles.

I've had one prehensile now for about 4 years, the other for about a year. My first prehensile was an "outreach" animal for it's previous owner, so she came to me a very docile, handleable animal. She is a confirmed female, weighs 820g (a beast!).



The second PTS is smaller, about 500g. It was an unknown sex and origin, not quite as friendly but calmed down over time.



One of the things I've found is that a great way to calm a PTS, if you can get it out of it's enclosure, is to wrap them in a towel like a feral cat. After a few minutes, there's much less of the huffing and puffing and open mouth threats.

These Ig Grips are also great: IgGear

I use these great foggers in their water dishes. Saves on spritzing with a water bottle.

I built a climbing area using a fake ficus tree, fake vine and a grape wreath at the top. The ficus has three main "trunks" and I mounted the wreath at the top for them to hang out on. Had to remove the leaves tho, too tempting to try to eat!

My last PTS experience is detailed here in this post ... the confirmation that my 2nd PTS is actually a boy!

Thanks!
The WillaWoman

Welcome to the group WillaWoman!!! It has been a bit slow here lately, but hopefully it will pick up now that there is a new member.

First off, your girl is a beauty. Additionally, there is a good chance that she is in fact a Corucia zebrata alfredschmidti. I say this due to her size, coloration, and eye color. I am not an expert, so this is just my opinion. There is an C.z.a keeper, Kisha, that has a male she is trying to sell. You may want to contact her as she knows way more about C.z.a than I do and you may wish to get her male.

You may wish to remove your foggers from the water dishes. I am not familiar with your model of fogger, but I have seen warnings on other ultrasonic foggers that indicate you should keep animals from coming in contact with them. I am not sure what hazard it may pose, but I would hate for your skinks to be electrocuted or something.

I have been thinking about getting some of those Ig Grips. Do you like them? Thanks for the tip about the towel for calming Corucia. My skinks are super tame, but it may come in handy in the future. Again, welcome to the group. Josh

Originally Posted by jrbl

First off, your girl is a beauty. Additionally, there is a good chance that she is in fact a Corucia zebrata alfredschmidti.

You may wish to remove your foggers from the water dishes.

I have been thinking about getting some of those Ig Grips. Do you like them?

Hello Josh, thanx for your reply!

I've been perusing these forums and saw the journal article on C.z.a's and yes, I do think she is one! She is a big beauty, strong as heck and very personable.

I dont think I'm in the market for another PTS at this time (I'd have lots of them, but the hubby has his limits!). I would love to get my two to mate, but even though the male seems "interested" in the female, she really hates his guts. She gave him a big bite today when I tried introducing her into his tank again.

Does anyone have any tips for getting two PTS's to like each other, at least enough to mate?

Thanks!
The WillaWoman

PS. I only put the foggers in when they are not active or not in the tank. Once the humidity is raised, I remove them.
PPS. I love the Ig Grips! Keeps my forearms scratch free and give the reptile a nice big area to grip.

When I saw the picture, and read that she weighed in at a hefty 820 grams, my first thought was that she is a C.z.alfredschmidti as well!

I would not recommend you put her in with your male for two reasons: 1) they are different subspecies, and it would be nice if we could keep the Cza and Czz bloodlines distinct in the captive U.S. population, and 2) she might try to kill him (because he is a different subspecies, and because Cza's are generally more aggressive).

If you would be interested in a trade for a couple of Czz females, let me know. I've been looking for a Cza female! Where did you get her???

-- Celeste

Also, the rate of still borns/slugs is much higher in hybrid pairings. So your chances of producing viable offspring from a pairing is low. I would love to know where you are located. Perhaps we could work something out to get you a pair that would like eachother and breed with out the expense of shipping. Lets keep this discussion going. I know that the majority of us here are committed to the propagation of the species, not the profit. We would all love to see every PTS in a successfully breeding group!

Kisha

There is an C.z.a keeper, Kisha, that has a male she is trying to sell. You may want to contact her as she knows way more about C.z.a than I do and you may wish to get her male.

Btw- Thanks Josh for the great compliment, I do get a bit obsessive when it comes to knowing about this species. I appreciate the comment!

Kisha

Originally Posted by seishin

When I saw the picture, and read that she weighed in at a hefty 820 grams, my first thought was that she is a C.z.alfredschmidti as well!

I would not recommend you put her in with your male for two reasons: 1) they are different subspecies, and it would be nice if we could keep the Cza and Czz bloodlines distinct in the captive U.S. population, and 2) she might try to kill him (because he is a different subspecies, and because Cza's are generally more aggressive).

If you would be interested in a trade for a couple of Czz females, let me know. I've been looking for a Cza female! Where did you get her???

-- Celeste

Yep, she's a big girl! Beautiful green coloration too.

I can't entertain a trade for her (or for my Czz). Since I've had her (Baby Doll) and Junior (the Czz), I've totally fallen in love!

I never got them with the intentions of breeding, I got them to be pets. But the fascination with this species has grown and I thought it would be wonderful to produce an offspring.

But with what I've been reading in this post, I'm not willing to allow the Cza to harm the Czz just for my own pleasure of having a baby. You've all convinced me!

Oh, I got the Cza from Darlene Walder at Signal Herp. She was her outreach animal, so she's very tame.

I got the Czz from a zookeeper with the St Louis zoo. He found me thru my local herp society and knew I was interested in this species. I don't know if he's WC or CB.

Thanx all!

I was reading the journal on Cza, and am I right in saying that there are no documented cases of viable offspring between Cza and Czz? Im not trying to cause any arguments at all, I just wasnt sure if thats what the journal suggested or not.

Originally Posted by johelian

I was reading the journal on Cza, and am I right in saying that there are no documented cases of viable offspring between Cza and Czz? Im not trying to cause any arguments at all, I just wasnt sure if thats what the journal suggested or not.

According to a post by Sheri Jones, one of the co-authors of the "Subspecies comparison of the Genus: Corucia" article:

"If you would ask me whether alfredschmidti could be paired with Corucia zebrata zebrata to produce viable offspring, we don't know. We haven't tried that..."

Kisha, you had mentioned that rate of still borns and slugs is much higher in hybrid pairings. Is this a general opinion for reptile breeding or do you know of attempted breedings of Cza's and Czz's that have produced these results?

Most of the infomation we have is either anecdotal, or direct observation. There are only a handful of people who are doing formal study of this species. I have spoken and read accounts of many who have kept Prehensile both before and after the import ban. Hobbyists only recently began to recognize the difference between the subspecies and are now trying to keep them separate. But back in the day, these guys were imported like crazy and you could buy a wild caught import for less than $100 sometimes. During this time many people kept groups of WC individuals together with varying degrees of success (mostly in Florida). Many of these original keepers do not have their animals anymore, so there is know way to know what sub species they housed together. I have read accounts of wildly successful groups and groups with high occurrence of still born/slugs. It is my interpretation that the less successful groups may have been hybrid groups. The Czz and Cza are not separate species, but sub species. The degree to which they are reproductively compatable is unknown, but in other situations of sub-species hybrid pairings can be successful to varying degrees, but is usually plagued by failure. If they were truly reproductively incompatible, scientists would have to designate them as separate species. I believe that there is the possibility that they could produce a hybrid offspring, I think that I may have accidentally had that happen (will need some help IDing my female, though). But, for the good of the species, and our emotional well being, the risk of failure is too much.

I hope all that made sense.

Kisha