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Board of Inquiry® This forum is provided exclusively for the discussion of specific persons or businesses in the herp industry. |
04-17-2012, 02:47 PM
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#271
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowAceD
It would be ill advised not refund to at this point.
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Correcting a typo.
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04-17-2012, 02:47 PM
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#272
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where is the evidence of that? all i see from those emails is SEAN doing the so called blackmailing and KEVIN apologizing for the other persons actions. I do not see where Kevin wrote anything of the sort of blackmailing.
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04-17-2012, 02:51 PM
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#273
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Here is the just of it right here Andrew!
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04-17-2012, 02:56 PM
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#274
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Potts
Hello, I'm sorry if it seems I don't care because that's the furthest from the truth and those who know me know I'm concerned about the situation. I wish everyone would return and re-read the e-mails I've posted.
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I suspect that the majority of us have and re-read them already. We're well aware of the rationale behind the choice you have made to commit theft. The problem is that many of us see that this principle you're standing on is pure self-serving fiction. NOTHING in that string of emails that you're so desperately clinging to does anything at all to negate the fact that your own ADMITTED shipping negligence brought about this whole debacle. If you hadn't dropped the ball in the first place, Sean wouldn't have been able to pick it and throw it back at you, now would he?
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04-17-2012, 03:02 PM
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#275
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Andrew-
I know you think that plugging your ears and stomping your feet while repeating over and over that Kevin is part of the scam makes you in the right here. But I'm sorry to report to you that it does not!
1) In one of your earlier emails you said dead boa OR pictures. He sent pictures....they have been vetted and shown to have been taken the day the boa arrived.
2) You ADMITTED that your shipping is the cause of this boas death.
What else matters in this case? Your Kevin is part of the scam crutch is becoming old and overused. There IS NO SCAM, you admitted so yourself.
Refund the man his money. Don't think that your "good" reputation in the reptile industry will keep you from being permanently labeled a bad guy!
I get the distinct feeling that you have spent this money already and do not have the ability to refund his money back to him. IF that is the case, then work out a payment plan and start getting him his money back.
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04-17-2012, 04:34 PM
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#276
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After staying away for a few days, I was hoping to come back to this thread and see that Andrew Potts had done the right thing and refunded Kevin's money.
I know neither party, but my take is this: Andrew, while I understood how a couple of e-mails upset you in the beginning, I believe that you need to drop the emotions from this equation and take care of business. If you guaranteed live arrival, but failed by using incorrect shipping methods, you need to refund your buyer's money in full, immediately.
Emotions play no part in business and getting upset at how your buyer acted (no matter how validated those feelings might be) is no reason to hold his money. More people than you realize are paying attention to how you are handling this situation. Good luck to everyone involved, especially the "paying customer"!
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04-17-2012, 04:37 PM
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#277
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Potts
Again Kevin was part of the Black-mail from the very begining. Andrew
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~If~ Kevin & Shawn were actual business partners, then Kevin could be held accountable for the actions of his business partner. However, they are not business partners.
~If~ Kevin were a part of the blackmail attempts, business partner or not, he could be held accountable. However, the fact is that it cannot be proven that Kevin is/was a part of the blackmail attempts. In actuality, whether Kevin agreed with it, or not, the only proof, in existence, shows that Kevin is/was against Sean's deplorable actions.
Legally speaking, your business was/is with Kevin and Kevin cannot be held accountable, for his friend's (non-partner's) actions, unless it can be shown that he did not attempt to put a stop to it. BTW If Kevin did attempt to put a stop to it, and was unsuccessful in his attempt, then he would remain in the position where he cannot be held accountable for Sean's actions.
The problem is that you are looking at Kevin & Sean as "one entity" when what you are dealing with, here, is ~two separate~ issues/people. You are also letting your anger, over Sean's actions, cloud good judgment.
Despite Kevin's friend's actions, you are in the absolute wrong by withholding Kevin's money/refund. No matter your suspicions, if you do not have proof that Kevin was/is a part of the blackmail attempts, you would lose in a court case since it can be shown that you, and you alone, are at fault for the snake's demise.
You need to treat Kevin separate from Sean.
As most have been saying, Kevin is due his refund and that is the course you should take.
Then (a separate issue) file charges, against Sean (for blackmail attempts), should you wish to do so.
None so blind as those who cannot see.
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04-17-2012, 05:19 PM
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#278
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There's one thing to keep in mind Andrew. You were resolving this with Kevin up until the point that Sean inserted himself in the situation, and had he not, it would have been long over. Given that fact, you and Kevin both should be going after him for his actions and all the ensuing problems caused by them. Contact Kevin and get him his money back. If it turns out he was in on it with the other two you can include him in that case later.
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04-17-2012, 06:14 PM
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#279
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Potts
Again Kevin was part of the Black-mail from the very begining. Andrew
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And what post would the proof of that be in? Did I miss that?
You BELIEVING Kevin was in on it, does not PROVE he was. As I pointed out earlier, you convince yourself of a lot of things, that you have yet to prove.
The only PROOF in this thread is that his friend acted like an idiot, and Kevin asked him to knock it off. And there is PROOF that you dropped the ball, through your own admission.
Stick to the facts now Mr. Potts. This isn't some thread that can be deleted. It's here forever, and now it has PROOF of you making libelous statements about Kevin.
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04-17-2012, 06:28 PM
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#280
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I'm not going to continue debating the situation any longer. Minds have been made up and that's life and I have to respect(may not agree) with the discourse which ensues. I'm not saying their right or wrong but no one was there except Sean, Connor, Kevin and myself. From the very beginning I planned to replace the snake even after I told them to go fish. I wanted them to go public so people could see Sean, Connor and Kevin are criminals. Did I get a little burned, yes but such is life and yes some will not buy from me because of this issue and that's what I will have to live with. Kevin knows what he has to do to get the ball rolling, and yes it's up to Kevin. Also if anyone wants to call me at 727-784-4739 I'll be more than happy to discuss the issue.
If I'm such a worthless piece of feces who is completely incompetent, why haven't hundreds of others come on here to tell of their horrible dealing with me. You won't because none exist.
A little into my mindset and how I think. Recently did a trade which the animal turned out to be the wrong sex. Enclosed a $50 check when we sent the wrong sexed snake back to the owner.
A year or so ago I met a fascination young man on Jeff Ronne's sight and he so impressed me I sold him a smoking male Aztec for $300 when at the time they were going for around $5,000 or $6,000. Guess what that male just produced Brent and Kenny a nice litter of Hytecs het something.
This ain't about money it's about what's right and Kevin knows he played both sides to a tee. Oh by the way I would have paid Kevin his cost to send dead boa back and then the cost to replace the boa. I tell all my customers if any problems occur they will not have to pay another penny in shipping cost. Oh yes and the six month guarantee.
I think it should be noted that since this is my only bad thread in 25 years and the extenuating circumstances of the thread, harm will be minimal. Unfortunately the vast majority of the human race tend to waiver when it concerns money, so I don't think I'm going to lose that much business.
Once again Kevin knows what he has to do to get the ball rolling so get with it Kevin. Andrew
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