Allen Belcher / Big Daddy's Wholesale ... WARNING

Don please don't post here to try to help me. I will ask you as I do any of my customers and friends to let the small group of haters here have their glory. You can't fix stupid! I will explain this statement in detail. No one can have continued success year after year and produce successful offspring in the mass that I do with any problems in the collection. Anyone who has more than a handful of snakes no matter what kind can testify to that. You have to feed them, clean them and try to imitate their natural enviroment as close as possible to have them thrive and reproduce. This thread is several years old now and people have asked in both this thread and others for anyone to give any negative experience with me or my snakes if there is any out there. NO ONE REPLIED!!! What's funny is that this season is my best on record yet. I will be around 80-100 clutches on ball pythons alone not counting the retics, burmese, boas and colubrids. GIVE ME A FREAKIN' BREAK! I am not trying to change anyones opinion of me, but just take a second and try to rationalize how I can continue to produce successful seasons year after year if I am not doing it right! I would love for Joe or anyone else to give me a logical reason as to how in the world I can continue to overcome IBD, bad care, not feeding and any other reason that anyone else has given at any point during this drama filled dialogue, and continue to produce or even survive! THE CAN'T FIX STUPID COMMENT SHOULD ONLY OFFEND YOU IF YOU FIT THE TITLE! I have said it before several times, ANY python with IBD can only survive a maximum of 28 days. So go fiqure out now how long it is that I have suppossedly had the disease. Bottom line is that I have already hatched and sold more snakes this season than most of you will have combined this year. NOT INTENDED TO INSULT ANYONE WITH THAT COMMENT, JUST STATING A FACT!
One last thing for Joe, You my friend have a serious hard on for me and my business, I want you to know that I am alright with my sexuality with a wife and four kids to the point that I can admit openly that it flatters me that another man is consummed with me like you are. However I want you to seek help for the addiction and fasination with me. As everyone knows a relationship has to be based on trust and not jealousy. It would never work!
Also how is it that no one else can see IBD but that you can? What kind of Mr. Wizzard are you?
Just thought I would add to the drama today, and give you something to chew on!

Allen Belcher 706-615-4772

Originally Posted by big daddy's wholesal

I have said it before several times, ANY python with IBD can only survive a maximum of 28 days.

No. Sorry. You're wrong.

"Confirmed cases of boas with IBD have been observed for MORE THAN 1 YEAR without development of clinical signs suggestive of IBD." ~Doug Mader, DVM Reptile Medicine and Surgery

This is why quarantine presents such a problem when it comes to these guys. The "normal" recommendation is 3 months, however recently 6 months or longer is now considered safer for boas and pythons and is highly recommended for LARGE and valuable collections. If the main collection and the quarantine facility are in the same building, no exchange of airflow should occur between the two and utensils and supplies should not be shared between facilities.

Originally Posted by big daddy's wholesal

I have said it before several times, ANY python with IBD can only survive a maximum of 28 days.

Originally Posted by JordanAng420

No. Sorry. You're wrong.

"Confirmed cases of boas with IBD have been observed for MORE THAN 1 YEAR without development of clinical signs suggestive of IBD." ~Doug Mader, DVM Reptile Medicine and Surgery

Boas don't act like pythons do when it comes to IBD.

Originally Posted by cahrens

Boas don't act like pythons do when it comes to IBD.

Yes, that is correct. In boas, the inclusion bodies are normally seen in the visceral organs, and in pythons they are seen more within the tissues of the central nervous system. The inflammatory response is more pronounced in pythons especially. It appears to progress faster with pythons than it does with boas, however...because of the variety of symptoms esp. between boas and pythons and very often a lack of inclusions within the epithelial cells of major organs in pythons, the disease goes undiagnosed in some cases.

Originally Posted by JordanAng420

Yes, that is correct. In boas, the inclusion bodies are normally seen in the visceral organs, and in pythons they are seen more within the tissues of the central nervous system. The inflammatory response is more pronounced in pythons especially. It appears to progress faster with pythons than it does with boas, however...because of the variety of symptoms esp. between boas and pythons and very often a lack of inclusions within the epithelial cells of major organs in pythons, the disease goes undiagnosed in some cases.

Are you saying there's cases of pythons serving as a host to IBD that are compeltely asymptomatic?

Garret Hebenstreit

Originally Posted by Garret

Are you saying there's cases of pythons serving as a host to IBD that are compeltely asymptomatic?

Garret Hebenstreit

In a nutshell, that is what I am saying. It is possible for them to serve as carriers of the disease.

Originally Posted by big daddy's wholesal

Don please don't post here to try to help me. I will ask you as I do any of my customers and friends to let the small group of haters here have their glory. You can't fix stupid! I will explain this statement in detail. No one can have continued success year after year and produce successful offspring in the mass that I do with any problems in the collection. Anyone who has more than a handful of snakes no matter what kind can testify to that. You have to feed them, clean them and try to imitate their natural enviroment as close as possible to have them thrive and reproduce. This thread is several years old now and people have asked in both this thread and others for anyone to give any negative experience with me or my snakes if there is any out there. NO ONE REPLIED!!! What's funny is that this season is my best on record yet. I will be around 80-100 clutches on ball pythons alone not counting the retics, burmese, boas and colubrids. GIVE ME A FREAKIN' BREAK! I am not trying to change anyones opinion of me, but just take a second and try to rationalize how I can continue to produce successful seasons year after year if I am not doing it right! I would love for Joe or anyone else to give me a logical reason as to how in the world I can continue to overcome IBD, bad care, not feeding and any other reason that anyone else has given at any point during this drama filled dialogue, and continue to produce or even survive! THE CAN'T FIX STUPID COMMENT SHOULD ONLY OFFEND YOU IF YOU FIT THE TITLE! I have said it before several times, ANY python with IBD can only survive a maximum of 28 days. So go fiqure out now how long it is that I have suppossedly had the disease. Bottom line is that I have already hatched and sold more snakes this season than most of you will have combined this year. NOT INTENDED TO INSULT ANYONE WITH THAT COMMENT, JUST STATING A FACT!
One last thing for Joe, You my friend have a serious hard on for me and my business, I want you to know that I am alright with my sexuality with a wife and four kids to the point that I can admit openly that it flatters me that another man is consummed with me like you are. However I want you to seek help for the addiction and fasination with me. As everyone knows a relationship has to be based on trust and not jealousy. It would never work!
Also how is it that no one else can see IBD but that you can? What kind of Mr. Wizzard are you?
Just thought I would add to the drama today, and give you something to chew on!

Allen Belcher 706-615-4772

Sorry to burst your bubble Allen but i cant stand you.In my opinion anyone who sells sick infected reptiles and then lies about it should be beat to death .

I agree with Maria. Im also a CVT and ECC (emergency) and we treat a lot of herps. A few months ago we had a client with an entire collection of pythons die of IBD, however no new snakes were purchased in 10 months. One of them was an asymptomatic carrier as far as we can tell, however, there is just no way to be certain. Perhaps the disease is more complicated than we thought or is mutating. There jst isnt enough research. Nothing can be ruled out until its a medical fact. I just thought I would throw that in here.
Aaron Scofield, CVT, ECC

Originally Posted by rin0425

I agree with Maria. Im also a CVT and ECC (emergency) and we treat a lot of herps. A few months ago we had a client with an entire collection of pythons die of IBD, however no new snakes were purchased in 10 months. One of them was an asymptomatic carrier as far as we can tell, however, there is just no way to be certain. Perhaps the disease is more complicated than we thought or is mutating. There jst isnt enough research. Nothing can be ruled out until its a medical fact. I just thought I would throw that in here.
Aaron Scofield, CVT, ECC

But if that were the case, the host would still be alive. No?

Garret Hebenstreit

Dont know...perhaps it incubated like in boas, or mutated in the host until it became lethal...who knows. I was just saying that there are many many possibilities out there and we just dont have enough info. Nothing more.