WTH Rich!

Originally Posted by norsmis

Pot, you are just as black as me. You seem to have the same attitude but its alright that you have it and I dont?

Did I come to your site attacking your actions or did you come here attacking me?

Anyone intending to blacken my eye can expect the same in return.

Originally Posted by Rich Z

Did I come to your site attacking your actions or did you come here attacking me?

Anyone intending to blacken my eye can expect the same in return.

I asked why you POSTED it on an open forum when the industry is under attack with legislation pending on banning the keeping of snakes. You attacked me with conspiracy theories of some slight from the past and how I am jealous of your retirement and how I have God syndrome..... all because some people, not just me, asked why?????

Originally Posted by norsmis

I asked why you POSTED it on an open forum when the industry is under attack with legislation pending on banning the keeping of snakes. You attacked me with conspiracy theories of some slight from the past and how I am jealous of your retirement and how I have God syndrome..... all because some people, not just me, asked why?????

For God's sakes Ronald this is America and we should have some freedom to post and discuss stuff without first looking around at the political climate.

Originally Posted by lucille

For God's sakes Ronald this is America and we should have some freedom to post and discuss stuff without first looking around at the political climate.

I am glad you have more faith in the politicians than I do..... Sorry but I dont trust em as far as I can throw em.
Apparently you havent been keeping up with whats going on lately Lucille. S373. I will leave it at that.

Originally Posted by norsmis

I asked why you POSTED it on an open forum when the industry is under attack with legislation pending on banning the keeping of snakes. You attacked me with conspiracy theories of some slight from the past and how I am jealous of your retirement and how I have God syndrome..... all because some people, not just me, asked why?????

I posted it because I thought the incident (http://www.cornsnakes.com/forums/showthread.php?t=91701) was interesting and exciting. I thought this would be self evident to everyone who saw that short video strip.....



And I still do. It would absolutely make my day if every time I walked around my property I could see something interesting like that laying about. Or are you suggesting I should carry my .22 and just kill every possibly "tainted" corn I find around here?

So since the industry is under attack, you therefore feel compelled to do a little trickle down attacking yourself?

And you wonder why this industry is in such sad shape? Wouldn't dare cross your mind that probably it's because many of the people in this industry will gleefully stab another in the back if given half a chance, now would it? They will use every opportunity they can to try to belittle another in order to try to raise their own status in the eyes of others, no matter what the consequences. So yeah, you keep on showing those forces you fear so much about how much leverage they can get out of molehill issues such as this so your self-fulfilling prophecy comes true. I do hope you will be proud of your efforts. Heck, maybe HSUS will even make you a poster child for them.

I will say this again........ I don't believe there was any likely potential harm from releasing captive raised corn snakes into their native range. Had I thought so, I wouldn't have done it. Period. It's over and done with. A done deal. There is absolute nothing at all that you can do to change the past.

As an aside, my colony had been closed for years to new blood lines, and the overall health of my animals was excellent. Matter of fact the buyer who bought most of my stock was so impressed with the quality of the animals that instead of selling them, decided to keep most for his own breeding stock. So there was no reasonable likelihood of contagious pathogens. Yes there was a plethora of genetic material in those released animals, but none of those genes were developed in some laboratory. They had resulted from mutations that are a natural process in any animal, whether sitting in captivity, or prowling about in the deepest recesses of some wilderness.

But heck, I'm just being redundant. I've said all this before in that thread indicated above over on my CornSnakes.com site. If you want to read more of my opinions about this issue, I've already covered them in spades over there.

If you all want to be pissed at me because my opinion differs from yours, then so be it.

Originally Posted by Rich Z

So since the industry is under attack, you therefore feel compelled to do a little trickle down attacking yourself?

Nope. Not at all. I call it holding the people in our hobby/industry accountable for their actions.

Originally Posted by Rich Z

And you wonder why this industry is in such sad shape? Wouldn't dare cross your mind that probably it's because many of the people in this industry will gleefully stab another in the back if given half a chance, now would it? They will use every opportunity they can to try to belittle another in order to try to raise their own status in the eyes of others, no matter what the consequences. So yeah, you keep on showing those forces you fear so much about how much leverage they can get out of molehill issues such as this so your self-fulfilling prophecy comes true. I do hope you will be proud of your efforts. Heck, maybe HSUS will even make you a poster child for them.

Yep, I am the problem Rich.
I think maybe HSUS will be making YOU their golden child. I am not the one releasing snakes in Florida.

Originally Posted by Rich Z

I will say this again........ I don't believe there was any likely potential harm from releasing captive raised corn snakes into their native range. Had I thought so, I wouldn't have done it. Period. It's over and done with. A done deal. There is absolute nothing at all that you can do to change the past.

As an aside, my colony had been closed for years to new blood lines, and the overall health of my animals was excellent. Matter of fact the buyer who bought most of my stock was so impressed with the quality of the animals that instead of selling them, decided to keep most for his own breeding stock. So there was no reasonable likelihood of contagious pathogens. Yes there was a plethora of genetic material in those released animals, but none of those genes were developed in some laboratory. They had resulted from mutations that are a natural process in any animal, whether sitting in captivity, or prowling about in the deepest recesses of some wilderness.

But heck, I'm just being redundant. I've said all this before in that thread indicated above over on my CornSnakes.com site. If you want to read more of my opinions about this issue, I've already covered them in spades over there.

If you all want to be pissed at me because my opinion differs from yours, then so be it.

I will use your own words against you here;

Originally Posted by Rich Z

So just who the hell do you think YOU are bub? You got some sort of cornered market on absolute truths or something?

What makes you so right and me so wrong Rich? You can bad mouth me, call me names, throw up your conspiracy theories, use all the smoke and mirrors you want but the simple fact is you did something that could potentially hurt everyone in this industry and you dont give a crap because you are done with it.

I started this thread because I felt what Rich did was wrong and could hurt this hobby. Now it is turning into bash Ron. Not cool. He is passionate about this hobby and doesn't want it to be damaged (just like me).
I still say anyone who thinks this practice of releasing captives snakes into the wild is wrong but will not argue with anyone on here further about it. I would much rather spend my time doing what I can to block proposed legislation that could destroy our rights to keep ANY animal other than a dog or cat.

Originally Posted by norsmis

Nope. Not at all. I call it holding the people in our hobby/industry accountable for their actions.

Yep, I released corn snakes within their native range. Nope, I don't believe I did anything wrong in doing so. So go ahead, arrest me now....

You can't turn back the clock to change anything, so what REALLY is your intention with all this? To try to cause my or my sites damage?

Originally Posted by norsmis

What makes you so right and me so wrong Rich? You can bad mouth me, call me names, throw up your conspiracy theories, use all the smoke and mirrors you want but the simple fact is you did something that could potentially hurt everyone in this industry and you dont give a crap because you are done with it.

Actually, I believe FACTS do. I am stating that there are no verifiable facts to prove that releasing corns in their native habitat is POSITIVELY, much less probably going to be damaging. You can say all you want about "potential" damage, but that is all just chicken little stuff, in my opinion. There can be potential harm in nearly everything you do, so does that mean you do absolutely NOTHING at all? Throwing snakes into the freezer is positively harmful to them. Giving the chance to live by releasing them, to me, is much more humane to the animals. Sorry, but I don't believe in just outright killing animals simply because some people have a "sky is falling" fear of something potential that has never been proven. Again, if you don't like my opinion, that's really just tough for you.

Oh yeah, since I am running a couple of sites very deeply involved in this industry, how did you come to the conclusion that I am "done with it"?

Originally Posted by SPJ

I started this thread because I felt what Rich did was wrong and could hurt this hobby. Now it is turning into bash Ron. Not cool. He is passionate about this hobby and doesn't want it to be damaged (just like me).
I still say anyone who thinks this practice of releasing captives snakes into the wild is wrong but will not argue with anyone on here further about it. I would much rather spend my time doing what I can to block proposed legislation that could destroy our rights to keep ANY animal other than a dog or cat.

Again, anyone who attempts to bash me can expect the same in return. Check the posts in this thread and see who started with the bashing. Sorry i didn't just lay down and expose my belly to the claws....

Originally Posted by Rich Z

You can't turn back the clock to change anything, so what REALLY is your intention with all this? To try to cause my or my sites damage?

I really doubt anyone here wants to cause damage to any of your sites Rich.

How many people that have read your posts now think it's ok to release captive bred animals to the wild? Is that really the message you want to people to take from this? If by bringing this to light we get the people reading this to understand it could potentially be disastrous to our industry, then so be it. I'm sorry if you see it differently and want to turn this in to something personal, but it isn't that way at all.