Exotics-r-us/ Ray Hunter/ Ricky D

I do not know Kevin but certainly know and have done business w/Ray and Ricky----In the many years I have purchased animals from them ( which is considerable) , I have yet to receive a specimen that was not as described. I also have received no specimens in poor condition.... once, I paid too much--received an immediate refund---these people are good folks who don't deserve slander--they should be praised for their honesty and moral fortitude---it sure seems to be absent in many individuals----ie; if the zapata fits--then wear it....Sincerely, Earl H. Turner AKA Cranky OLD FART !!

Well it is now SATURDAY AT 11:36 AM EST. I do believe that is well past friday afternoon and still no pictures. In the imortal words of Homer Simpson " D'oh".

Kevin you need to stop lieing about everything and side stepping every question that has been asked of you it is getting to the point you making lies up to cover lies and its getting harder for you to keep them straight.

I was willing to believe at one time you had recieved a few bad snakes and I would have been one of the first to tell Ray he was wrong as I have in the past. I know Ray Goushaw would have done the exact same. But all you care to do from reading these post is keep bad mouthing. Well you could have stopped this a long time ago with pictures of the proof. Now its gone so far your credability is shot to hell. I am curious though as to now if pictures do show up WHO did you get the dead snakes from? Or did you freeze off the good ones you were sent just to look like your right?

Come on man it only takes a few hours to kill a snake in the freezer and take the pictures! Oh but wait you could have took the pictures from day one so DID YOU REALLY SELL THOSE TO SOMEONE ELSE BEHIND YOUR PARTNERS BACK and now are trying to cover your own buttocks?

Scott Bice

Oregon Cruelty to Animals Statutes

TITLE 16. CRIMES AND PUNISHMENTS
CHAPTER 167. OFFENSES AGAINST PUBLIC HEALTH, DECENCY AND ANIMALS

167.310. Definitions for ORS 167.310 to 167.350.
As used in ORS 167.310 to 167.350:

(1) "Animal" means any nonhuman mammal, bird, reptile, amphibian or fish.

(2) "Good animal husbandry" includes, but is not limited to, the dehorning of cattle, the docking of horses, sheep or swine, and the castration or neutering of livestock, according to accepted practices of veterinary medicine or animal husbandry.

(3) "Livestock" has the meaning provided in ORS 609.010.

(4) "Pet or domestic animal" means any animal that is owned or possessed by a person, other than livestock or poultry.

(5) "Physical injury" has the meaning provided in ORS 161.015.

(6) "Possess" has the meaning provided in ORS 161.015.

(7) "Serious physical injury" has the meaning provided in ORS 161.015.

(8) As used in ORS 167.325 and 167.330, "Minimum care" means care sufficient to preserve the health and well-being of an animal and, except for emergencies or circumstances beyond the reasonable control of the owner, includes, but is not limited to, the following requirements:

(a) Food of sufficient quantity and quality to allow for normal growth or maintenance of body weight.

(b) Open or adequate access to potable water in sufficient quantity to satisfy the animal's needs. Snow or ice is not an adequate water source.

(c) In the case of pet or domestic animals, access to a barn, dog house or other enclosed structure sufficient to protect the animal from wind, rain, snow or sun and which has adequate bedding to protect against cold and dampness.

(d) Veterinary care deemed necessary by a reasonably prudent person to relieve distress from injury, neglect or disease.

(e) Pet or domestic animals shall not be confined to an area without adequate space for exercise necessary for the health of the animal or which does not allow access to a dry place for the animal to rest. The air temperature in a confinement area must be suitable for the animal involved. Confinement areas must be kept reasonably clean and free from excess waste or other contaminants which could affect the animal's health.


167.312. Research and animal interference.
(1) A person commits the crime of research and animal interference if the person knowingly does any of the following:

(a) Releases, steals or otherwise causes the death, injury or loss of any animal at or from an animal research facility, other than death, injury or loss incurred during or as the result of legitimate animal medical research and experimentation.

(b) Damages, vandalizes or steals any property in or on an animal research facility for the purpose of damaging, destroying or delaying animal medical research or experimentation.

(c) Obtains access to an animal research facility by misrepresentation for the purpose of performing acts not authorized by that facility.

(d) Enters an animal research facility to destroy, alter, duplicate or obtain unauthorized possession of records, data, materials, equipment or animals.

(e) Obtains or exerts unauthorized control over records, data, materials, equipment or animals of any animal research facility for the purpose of using, concealing, abandoning or destroying such records, data, materials, equipment or animals.

(f) Possesses or uses equipment or animals that the person reasonably believes have been obtained by theft or deception from an animal research facility or without the authorization of an animal research facility.

(2) For the purposes of this section, "animal research facility" means any facility engaging in legal scientific research or teaching involving the use of animals.

(3) Research and animal interference is a Class C felony.

(4) In addition to any other penalty imposed for violation of this section, a person convicted of such violation is liable:

(a) To the owner of the animal for damages, including the costs of restoring the animal to confinement and to its health condition prior to commission of the acts constituting the violation;

(b) For damages to real and personal property caused by acts constituting the violation; and

(c) For the costs of repeating an experiment, including the replacement of the animals, labor and materials, if acts constituting the violation cause the failure of an experiment.


167.315. Animal abuse in the second degree.
(1) A person commits the crime of animal abuse in the second degree if, except as otherwise authorized by law, the person intentionally, knowingly or recklessly causes physical injury to an animal.

(2) Any practice of good animal husbandry is not a violation of this section.

(3) Animal abuse in the second degree is a Class B misdemeanor.


167.320. Animal abuse in the first degree.
(1) A person commits the crime of animal abuse in the first degree if, except as otherwise authorized by law, the person intentionally, knowingly or recklessly:

(a) Causes serious physical injury to an animal; or

(b) Cruelly causes the death of an animal.

(2) Any practice of good animal husbandry is not a violation of this section.

(3) Animal abuse in the first degree is a Class A misdemeanor.


167.322. Aggravated animal abuse in the first degree.
(1) A person commits the crime of aggravated animal abuse in the first degree if the person:

(a) Maliciously kills an animal; or

(b) Intentionally or knowingly tortures an animal.

(2) Aggravated animal abuse in the first degree is a Class C felony.

(3) As used in this section, "maliciously" means intentionally acting with a depravity of mind and reckless and wanton disregard of life.


167.325. Animal neglect in the second degree.
(1) A person commits the crime of animal neglect in the second degree if, except as otherwise authorized by law, the person intentionally, knowingly, recklessly or with criminal negligence fails to provide minimum care for an animal in such person's custody or control.

(2) Animal neglect in the second degree is a Class B misdemeanor.


167.330. Animal neglect in the first degree.
(1) A person commits the crime of animal neglect in the first degree if, except as otherwise authorized by law, the person intentionally, knowingly, recklessly or with criminal negligence:

(a) Fails to provide minimum care for an animal in such person's custody or control; and

(b) Such failure to provide care results in serious physical injury or death to the animal.

(2) Animal neglect in the first degree is a Class A misdemeanor.


167.335. Exemption from ORS 167.315 to 167.330.
Unless gross negligence can be shown, the provisions of ORS 167.315 to 167.330 shall not apply to:

(1) The treatment of livestock being transported by owner or common carrier;

(2) Animals involved in rodeos or similar exhibitions;

(3) Commercially grown poultry;

(4) Animals subject to good animal husbandry practices;

(5) The killing of livestock according to the provisions of ORS 603.065;

(6) Animals subject to good veterinary practices as described in ORS 686.030;

(7) Lawful fishing, hunting and trapping activities;

(8) Wildlife management practices under color of law; and

(9) Lawful scientific or agricultural research or teaching that involves the use of animals.


The above I think will speak for itself but just to make certain KEVIN understands this.

#1 167.310. Definitions for ORS 167.310 to 167.350.
As used in ORS 167.310 to 167.350:

(1) "Animal" means any nonhuman mammal, bird, reptile, amphibian or fish.

Notice how they actually said REPTILE.

#2 (8) As used in ORS 167.325 and 167.330, "Minimum care" means care sufficient to preserve the health and well-being of an animal and, except for emergencies or circumstances beyond the reasonable control of the owner, includes, but is not limited to, the following requirements: d) Veterinary care deemed necessary by a reasonably prudent person to relieve distress from injury, neglect or disease.

Kevin you yourself have admitted to knowing the animals were sick so BY LAW why didn't you have them treated by VET?

Now I wont post the animal cruelty ones here from above because I am no attourney and honestly cant figure out which of them applies to Kevin but I personally think they all do.

Scott Bice

I've gotta think kevin is done with this thread...it seems like he just looks worse and worse with every reply he makes. When he initially posted I thought he may have been credible, and IF he had somehow reported what was going on inside the 24 hour time frame, that he may have a legitimate claim.

Now he just seems like a whiney, lying fool.

If I recall correctly (i'm too lazy to look back thru all the posts) kevin said different snakes get different doses of medication irrespective of weight (this was brought up during the scale issue). While I am not a vet, I don't think that is accurate. I understood that a dose of flagyl was figured on the animal's weight, irrespective of the species. In fact, when getting meds from a local vet, he wasn't interested in what kind of snake it was, just the weight.

Steve (biff) you are 100% correct, you MUST have a scale to correctly figure the dose of an antibiotic. There are some animals that respond better to different antibiotics, but you still need to know the animal's weight to dose properly. He was just proving to us all that he is most unqualified.

Blessings
Ray

The statement that different species(snakes) react differently to meds is a misnomer. Now in some types of animals I.E. larger felines(Cats) Tigers are very sensitive to different types of anesthetics. Other species I.E. Servals can have a wider margin for error. This does not hold true for snakes. You go by weight. Some types of anesthetics are indeed safer. In regards to antibiotics you MUST have a scale and again it doesn't matter the snake species. Some types are safer than others I.E. Batril, Amakin etc. Other like Chloramphenical, Gentamicin.(Different trade names/spellings) are very hard on the specimen. A determination as to gram negative or gram positive is essential as well as a work-up in regards to resistance is needed. In regards to parasites again doesn't so far as I am aware make a big differencepecies. You cannot however, give Ivermectin to tortoises. Panacur, Fenbedazol, Ivermectin, Paraciticide etc all can be use. However, the vector must be known. Dosages are important. Too little and you only aggravate
the parasite and they will migrate sometimes killing the specimen.
Also, multiple treatments are sometimes need. Keep in mind also that with Flagell(Metronidazole) you can kill off harmful as well as beneficial protozoa and bacteria that is neede for the gut in some species. Well these are just general guidelines there are exceptions. Thanks RayG. HBR sorry about the mistakes my computer for some reason would not let me go back and correct.

I've delt with Ray and Exotics R-us for the last year and I have never had any problems with the animals I purchased. Ray has always been truthful with me and would tell me if an animal was not eating or if there were any health issues. I have to commend Ray for all the times he sent me quality animals.
Thanks
Mike
Sideshow Exotics

Well Kevin,
I am sure you are reading the posts. YOU GOT CAUGHT IN A LIE.
Your credibility is now shot. Good luck selling any more of your venomoids. So much for the pics HUH. I think all these animals are doing fine, and you were just trying to pull a scam. DIDNT WORK. Have a nice life you lying sack of $%^#.
Jesse Smith

I plan on contacting the proper authorites in oregon, and getting you in deep ^&%$. What you are doing to your(even though they shouldn't be), animals is sick and wrong. You are a butcher. Just for the simple fact that you aren't a DVM, you shouldn't be aloud to cut on these animals. You give the whole hobby a bad name.
Jesse Smith

Jesse and anyone else interested.

Contact the Oregon fish and wildlife dept at

http://www.dfw.state.or.us/

Also you might want to contact the Oregon branch of the United States Fish and Wildlife at

http://pacific.fws.gov/

And certainly the Oregon branch of the DEA at

http://www.dea.gov/pubs/states/orego..._releases.html

Scott Bice