Allen Both - Reptile Kingdom

Originally Posted by Ben2112

Mabey I'll call him out in front of everyone at the next White Plains show. I throw my vet bills in his face!

Why not? My recommendation, though, is that you do it professionally without making a big scene. Show him in black and white firmly, yet professionally.

Originally Posted by Patrick@ColorfulCreatures

It's never okay to request animals without having the funds and even if intending to pay eventually, in my opinion it's theft to take animals you can't afford and lying about having money you don't is definitely theft.

You know there is no retailer out there that would accept that from a hobbyist that is trying to make a retail purchase. Why should a hobbyist or wholesaler accept that from a retailer trying to make a wholesale purchase?

Hello, i am here to address some issues again

First in the matter of the blood python this is what was said --->

"My Borneo Short Tail had the very beginning stages of a Respitory Infection that probably no one would have noticed at first glance. A very light popping sound when she breathed could not have been audible in the middle of a large trade show. I also did not notice the mites until after a week or two when I saw one crawling on her. "

- If it was such a mild resp infection that it was undetectable keeping it at the right temps or slightly elevated temps would most likely clear it right up. Secondly, you noticed a mite crawling on the snake two weeks later, why assume the snake had these mites and did not get them once in your care. When you purchase animals there is a certain responsibility to care for them properly so they don't get sick. If it had mites when you got it and didn't treat them for two weeks, it would have been covered, there would not be just one mite on it.

As far as business practices, no one knows anything about my business, my accounts receivable, how its run, etc, etc except for me, so to pass judgement without a shred of fact is kinda unfair. Also, in case everyone is green to this every business that operates in our country owes money to something or someone, it is just the way it is. Sometimes certain circumstances cause payments to be delayed, especially in such a rough and tight economy. Patrick, i did not seek you out looking to buy your chameleons you contacted me, i did let you know that 20 of them was a lot for me and i contacted another dealer that i know to split them because yes, i could afford and would have liked to have a ten lot of them, the pictures of the father were awesome. When i received them i was a bit taken back by the size, i have had 3 month old panthers before and they were much larger, and the two month old ones were really tiny. The size caused the other guy to back out leaving me holding the bag and stuck with tiny chameleons that can not be sold til who knows when because people are afraid of them and will not pay even what you charged me for them.

Allen you never sent the half you claimed you had and if you had this wouldn't even been posted. You claim the other guy backed out cause they were too small, fine but there were plenty that were definitely not and you could have given them those. You told me about 5 were on the small side and I told to not pay for them, they are definitely large enough now and you are making extra cash due to the fact that they were free. Also if you don't have my money may I suggest a payday loan because your problems should not be mine. How many of my chameleons do you still have?

Also if you only wanted 10 then you should have only asked for 10. I DID contact you and told you what I had available not that I would only sale the 20. The father is awsome and you got a good deal and I have sold several panthers and have never heard this crap about the size and the smaller ones were only 2 1/2 months which I stated in my email that ages ranged from 2 1/2 to three months cause my cluthches hatch in those intervals.

Seems to me that if people would stop sending Allen, or anyone else for that matter, animals before they pay for them most of these types of BOI threads would never be here....

Patrick, i am not trying to not pay you, but 10 were for the other guy and he said the big ones were too small and the price was crazy, those are not my words, but what i was told by another very large dealer, that probably owes a lot of people money too. That is the half i was going to send you right away because on the phone he comitted to me he would take them and i actually did intend on sending you the full payment right away, but for one reason or another, bounced check or what not, that did not happen. There is no arguement about paying you here, you will get paid.

Also, i am fully aware of all of my animals condition and health and we can for our animals better than any other wholesaler out there, that is a fact.

Allen why don't you just shut the hell up. I did everything Bloodpythons.com forum told me to do and the Respitory Infection continued. None of my snakes has had any mites so once again I will tell you to stop passing the buck by suggesting they were from my animals. It makes you look stupid. The one mite I saw led to about 20 others that were on her. You also look like an ass trying to tell people that probably know more than you that there is a certain responsibility to caring for animals. DUH!!! You should practice what you preach. If you did, I wouldn't even be here complaining about you!! Mabey I will be professional about what I say to people concerning your business at the next White Plains show and do so discretely. You still suck. ...PUNK!!

Originally Posted by ReptileKIngdom

As far as business practices, no one knows anything about my business, my accounts receivable, how its run, etc, etc except for me, so to pass judgement without a shred of fact is kinda unfair. Also, in case everyone is green to this every business that operates in our country owes money to something or someone, it is just the way it is. Sometimes certain circumstances cause payments to be delayed, especially in such a rough and tight economy.

Many here do know something about your business. We know what we know because non-payment and/or delayed payment for animals received is not an isolated incident. I have owned a body piercing business for the past 10 years. I don't owe anyone anything.

Originally Posted by Ben2112

Allen why don't you just shut the hell up. I did everything Bloodpythons.com forum told me to do and the Respitory Infection continued. None of my snakes has had any mites so once again I will tell you to stop passing the buck by suggesting they were from my animals. It makes you look stupid. The one mite I saw led to about 20 others that were on her. You also look like an ass trying to tell people that probably know more than you that there is a certain responsibility to caring for animals. DUH!!! You should practice what you preach. If you did, I wouldn't even be here complaining about you!! Mabey I will be professional about what I say to people concerning your business at the next White Plains show and do so discretely. You still suck. ...PUNK!!

Well, so much for professionalism, huh?

I would like to agree with Allen on this subject. Alot of breeders do owe money of some sort to others on a consistent basis, whether it be for animals purchased for their own collections or animals to be re-sold, it is the nature of the business. (please note that I did not say ALL breeders operate this way, but there are many) Even the largest of breeders cannot always produce enough animals to satisfy demand, therefore purchase animals for re-sale which can often lead to " money owed ". This does not make them a bad or unreputable breeder. However if it is, or becomes a continuous problem with a certain individual, then I agree with SAM, people should stop giving animals to these individuals prior to payment being recieved.

Second, to address Sam. He is absolutely correct in his statement, " IF PEOPLE"..... As we have all seen right here on the BOI. How many bad posts have been made on certain individuals or companies, to only have someone else post about a bad experience they recently had with one of those in reference?

How many times have we all heard or seen someone complain about the death of their imported animal bought from an Importer for a good price. "IF PEOPLE" ..........

How many times have we heard the complaining and whining from vendors and buyers alike that there are to many shows, the market is saturated etc... "IF PEOPLE".......

And the list could go on and on.

Lets face it Sam, "IF PEOPLE", you are absolutely correct, half of the BOI threads would not be here and would not be nessecary or needed.

Originally Posted by Ben2112

Allen why don't you just shut the hell up. I did everything Bloodpythons.com forum told me to do and the Respitory Infection continued. None of my snakes has had any mites so once again I will tell you to stop passing the buck by suggesting they were from my animals. It makes you look stupid. The one mite I saw led to about 20 others that were on her. You also look like an ass trying to tell people that probably know more than you that there is a certain responsibility to caring for animals. DUH!!! You should practice what you preach. If you did, I wouldn't even be here complaining about you!! Mabey I will be professional about what I say to people concerning your business at the next White Plains show and do so discretely. You still suck. ...PUNK!!

I realize you are upset but it really isn't necessary to act like a 13 year old; the profanity and name calling aren't casting a favorable light on you or your situation...