Brandon Griffey

I'm here to vouch for Brandon, I have known him and we have bought and sold animals to each other for the last five years. I have never had any issues with him or his animals and consider him to be very fair.

Seems like a refund would be due to him considering the time the snake remained alive in his care and because of the length Brandon has gone to ascertain the health, or lack there of, upon the snakes death.

I hope that this matter can be handled between these too gentlemen without anyone's name being dragged through the mud and this public bashing.

Good luck to both parties in finding some settlement.

It's not public bashing. This is the BOI--people post info from experiences and ask questions.

I read a few unnecessary negative remarks, you can call that what you want; I call that bashing.

Like a said I had good experiences with him.

I've done business with Brandon in the past, so I dont know if that makes me biased or not, but here is my opinion.

I personally would give back one of the snakes that I recieved. Maybe both, just to be done with the whole scenario. I can see where Brandon's/Tom's practices are at very least "questionable" and could have definitely sped up/caused the infection. But... I would also take my own practices (Xavier) into my thought process... Most of us know the effect "breeding season" can have on a healthy adult male Ball Python. Stress is involved and it can sometimes "effect" a big healthy male. So taking a hatchling, feeding it on a schedule to get it to breeding size as quick as possible, breeding it to multiple females, and then putting it up for sale as a breeder male... All before its first birthday, just seems "questionable" to me... Could that type of "lifestyle" be the most positive on a hatchling Ball Python? Could the stress of "power feeding" and early breeding create similar stress to lack of quarantine and instant introduction? I dont know... I think this young snake had pretty crazy life for a snake under a year of age. I would think some responsibility would be present from any "decent" seller.

I also find it very funny that some people can respond so self righteously positive that Brandon/Tom killed the snake, yet there is zero proof eitherway. I am surprised that some of you have such vast knowledge that you can say what caused the problems and wether they were pre-existing, or that the shipping and new home was so much more "stressfull" than his previous living conditions. Its good to know that your not jumping on either of the sides that can not be proven!

To be honest... I am also surprised that anyone would purchase/trade or sell/trade a 2011 as a breeder male... Just seems funny to me from either side of the fence. Surprises all around!

None of us know for sure what killed the snake, we are purely speculating.
What we do know contributed to its death is the stress caused by immediate breeding attempts upon arrival.
You should reread things and how they were said before assuming what was meant.

Mr. Baker, in my opinion, it doesn't matter that the snake was raised quickly and was used for breeding by Xavier, as long as Brandon/Tom knew that when they bought it.
They chose to breed (or attempted to) it more upon arrival, knowing its past. They chose not to let it acclimate. It doesn't matter which stress killed it deader, that which came at Xavier's facility or at Tom's facility. It continued to be stressed by (and ultimately died in) Tom's care.

If you buy a snake, regardless of what the seller says, "Healthy, proven breeder, ready to breed, etc.," a new snake should be put in QT. If the Potion was breeding all year, chances are he was off feed for a few months. Breeding takes a toll on a snake, male or female, and that combined with being off feed makes a snake its weakest during and right after breeding season. If you get a male during this period of time, there is no way in hell I would put it right away, in with females, no matter what condition it arrives in. The stress of shipping plus the stress of a new encloser, plus the fact it may or may not have eaten in awhile, plus the fact that it is introduced to new females and introduced so quickly, without a chance to settle in, probably contributed to its death. A weakened animal can sucumb to a condition that normaly it could fight off.

Let's say it had the ulcers, and had had them for an extended period of time. It lived just fine with them because it was not overly stressed. What if it just got the ulcers? Again, the stress it endured probably caused the ulcers to become aggrevated...

I think Rattrap learned an expensive lesson that we all should learn from.

This is a very unfortunate event for both parties, however, the lack of conscience that's taken place has by far separated this BOI thread from most others. I see no bad guy on either side and with the amount of actual data presented at this point, this thread might have saved a lot of embarrassment for both if it had never surfaced. If you removed all the supposition from this thread, we would still be on page one.

Originally Posted by Focal

This is a very unfortunate event for both parties, however, the lack of conscience that's taken place has by far separated this BOI thread from most others. I see no bad guy on either side and with the amount of actual data presented at this point, this thread might have saved a lot of embarrassment for both if it had never surfaced. If you removed all the supposition from this thread, we would still be on page one.

very true, just so many resident "experts" wont let the parties work it out. Tom Baker made a great point , why is noone upset that the snake was less than a year old and in breeding mode? And no one has said anything about xavier breeding it. He is the one who feed it to the size (700 grams) it is and did bred it. maybe the power feeding and the stress from breeding may have contributed to the issues that the potion had. And no one is asking why xavier bred and sold it, maybe he too is in it for the $$$ and felt he didnt need it any more as it had bred all the females xavier wanted it too?

Originally Posted by Kevin S

very true, just so many resident "experts" wont let the parties work it out. Tom Baker made a great point , why is noone upset that the snake was less than a year old and in breeding mode? And no one has said anything about xavier breeding it. He is the one who feed it to the size (700 grams) it is and did bred it. maybe the power feeding and the stress from breeding may have contributed to the issues that the potion had. And no one is asking why xavier bred and sold it, maybe he too is in it for the $$$ and felt he didnt need it any more as it had bred all the females xavier wanted it too?

Wow, this really needs to be gone over again? Really?

IF Tom had set the snake aside and allowed it to acclimate properly, there would be little question on how to proceed. As Tom points out, he was well aware that the snake was too young to breed, and aware that it had been raised quickly to do so. He ignored that risk, ignored the snakes need to acclimate, and bred it immediately anyway. He took a calculated risk and lost.