Josh of OUTBACK REPTILES

Originally Posted by Snake-Queen

Everyone seems to be missing my point.

All the information we have been given was supplied by a third party, which is against the rules ... especially since tithe third party has not been named.

I find it interesting that many BOI regulars have not called the OP out on it before now. So until this 3rd party is named, there is no evidence.

This.

Originally Posted by FireStorm

I agree completely. I also think that the evidence (picture) isn't very good to begin with in addition to being provided by an unknown 3rd party.

and this.

However, Josh did say he was working on a way for them to confirm the sex of the snake. I have no doubt in my mind that Outback will handle this.

Originally Posted by Snake-Queen

Everyone seems to be missing my point.

All the information we have been given was supplied by a third party, which is against the rules ... especially since tithe third party has not been named.

I find it interesting that many BOI regulars have not called the OP out on it before now. So until this 3rd party is named, there is no evidence.

I think some have bypassed that whole chapter in favor of a proposed video.
Even the seller is not taking the supplied picture very seriously.

Originally Posted by Josh@Outbackreps

I spoke with him today, and we are working on a way to verify the animal (and sex) to get the situation resolved as soon as possible.
.

Originally Posted by SPJ

The snake was mis-sexed. The buyer deserves a refund. QT issues?.......C'mon, this is Outback. They have fresh imports, CH babies, established animals, etc all out on display right next to each other. In this case I think the QT aspect is a moot point.

But..but..There were two differentsnakes pictured in a breeding scenario. :::gasp::: The OP said that it was in the midst of a pairing, then shows a picture that has two different snakes in it!? What a crock...he must be up to something. Clearly, the 'junk' was cropped from the other snake and superimposed onto the 'female'.

But..but..there was a 3rd party anonymous post. As if anyone would be berating him any less if he had just lied and said it was his own picture. First it wasn't good enough because it didn't show the whole snake, now it's not good enough cause he didn't take it and hasn't named his friend. Ok, fine. Ziggy Stardust took the picture. Now that my theoretical scenario gets us past his dastardly dodging of protocol, does it change anything? Is his evidence suddenly good enough for you? FFS

I mean, history has shown us that no one can be trusted. Except, oddly enough, a seller that has been generally non-communicative when it comes to actually addressing what certainly appears to be his own mistake.

Originally Posted by ApexPredatorBoids

a seller that has been generally non-communicative when it comes to actually addressing what certainly appears to be his own mistake.

You have a good point. While apparently this is a busy time for the seller with hatching snakes and whatnot, , it wasn't too busy to sell the snake.
The resolution was kicked upstairs by Josh to the owner. There is nothing wrong with that. But now that has happened, a resolution should be offered.
There are only so many solutions, it should not drag on, that is not good for either party.

And one more thing before I give up on this one. Do you really think a probing video proves a damn thing if it's done by someone who intends to deceive, as everyone seems to assume is the OP's intent? A video can show you exactly how much pressure someone is exerting on the probe, and whether or not it's the proper amount? There's a definite cut-off for what differentiates a male from a female? I guess you're saying there's absolutely no grey area when using sub-caudal scale counts to determine sex? It'd be pretty easy to only stick a probe in only as far as you need to, to 'prove' it's a female. Which I'm sure, based on the tone of some of the replies here, some nay-sayer would be sure to point out. A hemipenis sticking out seems pretty solid, to me. A certain degree of distrust is natural, but I think some of you are taking it wayyyy too far.

Originally Posted by Python Dreams

My point is that all of the little details about who had it, who sexed it, or this amount of time passed, etc... Is all pretty much bs IMO... If Josh agrees that is was the same snake, then the rest is irrelevant. If you sale a sexed snake wrong, that is your error, regardless of time. If you only guarantee the sex of the snake on arrival, then that should be stated in your TOS.

The buyer is not gaining anything here, so he sends the snake back under the terms that when it arrives if sexed a male a refund should be given. If its sexed a female, the buyer doesn't get a refund and has the option to pay shipping again to get the snake back.

If he wanted a female in exchange and no refund that would be very questionable as a swap could of happened. A refund of some type without returning the snake i also believe is unfair to the seller. Someone said it before its $150 that Outback is losing, thats pennies to them, and if it is a male then thats their fault. Is it worth a bad rap? At this point Outback isn't even trying to resolve the situation which no matter the outcome looks bad on them IMO.

Originally Posted by Keys & Kritterz

At this point Outback isn't even trying to resolve the situation which no matter the outcome looks bad on them IMO.

Yes they are.

Originally Posted by Josh@Outbackreps

I am waiting to hear from the Owner of the company (Ian) on how he wants to handle the situation, before I make any formal post as it's out of my hands right now due to the time passed on the transaction, but wanted to put a time time on the sexing in question.

The snake was purchased on 3/25/12 and received 3/29/12 and I received a email on June 4th saying it was mis-sexed. This is a time frame that was 2 days shy of 10 weeks.

We were also told he was in with one of the OP males, and not a "friends" male.

While not a reason for the delay in replies, given the situation, and the amount of time elapsed, along with the picture we received (same as in thread) I had to pass the situation to the owner to see how we could handle it, and did not realize he had not replied to the buyer yet. (Its breeding season for our balls and rainbows so he has been tied up the last few weeks, not a excuse but a reason for the delay). I spoke with him today, and we are working on a way to verify the animal (and sex) to get the situation resolved as soon as possible.

I will let the OP know what we decide is the best solution as soon as I hear from the owner.

Thats what Josh said, how long does it take to resolve a small situation like this? Quit beating around the bush and dragging feet and get it taken care of.

What I don't get is, if YOU the seller mis-sex an animal and sell it to your customer, why do you only allow them a certain time to catch YOUR mistake? I don't understand punishing YOUR customer for believing in YOU, and not catching YOUR mistake.

If this is the snake that Outback sold to the OP, I don't understand why a full refund is not a good resolution for some folks.

Originally Posted by Matt2979

What I don't get is, if YOU the seller mis-sex an animal and sell it to your customer, why do you only allow them a certain time to catch YOUR mistake?

perhaps this would be a good topic for the discussion threads? In an effort to not derail this, adding my response to an open thread in business discussion forums.
http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/foru...d.php?t=205313