Aptor

Yes Kelli,

I have been emailing Alberto about this, but he claims they are different. He says they look the same, because they both came from the Carrot Head Jungle Giant Albinos.

I think It's BS. I think they are the same!!!

I know I wont buy anything from Ron Tremper, because of his customer service and the whole GIANT thing.

Matt

We have Rons nice confident website stating about Gaints being recessive then 2 years later what happens? Ah I have no idea why he thinks his are different. Come on guys you breed your best albinos to eahc other and thier offspring for a few years and your saying its a new morp, that sounds to me liek some ones not thinking your producing something purely from selective breeding. Its not like your seeing a albino hatch for the first time....

Ah, I agree completely. Just because a trait is inheritable per se, does not make it recessive! For instance, you breed two nice orange hypo tangs (selectively bred HT's, not Hine line) together, you are pretty much going to produce nice orange hypo tang babies. But when you breed one of those nice hypo tangs to a normal, you are not going to get "hets".

Again, this is just my opinion, but I think that the "patternless" trait is a selectively bred trait that Ron worked for several generations to refine. He should be applauded for that, they are beautiful geckos, but I just do not see how the trait can be classified as a true recessive trait.

They sure look the same to me. Oh well, what do I know? I'm just a leopard gecko breeder, I don't know jack squat about marketing.

Yeah Kelli, you don't know JACK!!! Youv'e only been doing this for how many years????? (sarcasm,lol)

Oh I know quite a lot about keeping and breeding! And I do know the difference between selectively bred, recessive and co dominant. But as far as marketing goes, I am not good at that. Sometimes I wish I was!

that the "hyglo" is nothing more than rons "super tangerine"-line .....i do not know about the patternless ron says his "super-tang"(the hyglo comes from ) is not the same gene as this patternless ! AND he IS or was offering carrotheads het for the trait ... wouldnt be long until the females come , and it could easily be proven-out

Is this patternless line he and you speak of, as alreayd brought up those adults aren't patternless. If that whats behind this "new" morph where did it come from? I guess why that little one look so different, I not for a second take Rons word for it. There so much that needs to be done and maybe he has done soem but he list no proff to back him up.
Xavier

I agree Xavier.

Matt

ok...

I'm calling BS...Ron pick up the WHOLE deck of cards now.

Who here is willing to GIVE (Donate) me at least trios of every current morph? I think it's time to begin working on my undergrad/master/PhD thesis! It's high time the leopard gecko community starts getting answers about what genes are doing what, instead of all you SHEEP (BAHHHH) following what Ron says.

I'm not even going to BEGIN trying to re-convey genetics. You people on here need to go back and RE-READ my genetics posts and get a freaking basic understanding. Ron has no clue....2 years ago giants are recessive and now suddenly they are co-dominant?! If they are co-dominant, that would explain his claim to super giants (quick get a back hoe, the feces are piling up and fast), but it doesn't explain why you breeders out there don't have any super giants from your giants. You've been had, welcome back to 1999 and the browning of tremper albinos all over again.

Get a clue....

Chris

you guys remember the rainbow leos....

APTOR....

<font size=8> APTOR = Rainbow X Tremper Albino</font>

Ron's "patternless" is his selectively bred form of hypos. All his patternless are are reduced pattern leos. As Kelli pointed out, you breed 2 hypos to one another you'll get some hypo looking babies, some better than mom and pops, other not. It's called a SELECTIVELY BRED mutation or, GASP, POLYGENIC. OH....MY...GAWD, like Chris just said polygenic?! Quick, someone search for my genetics posts on the giants and find where I talk about height (length in the case of leos) and how it's MULTIPLE genes (uh oh...here it comes again...ahhhhhh a.k.a POLYGENIC).

I hate it when I'm right. I'm not going for a biology major with emphasis on genetic for NOTHING you guys, c'mon!

Chris