TOS posted in an ad today.

Terms:

1) Live arrival guarantee only on shipments sent airport to airport (air freight)
2) No live arrival for shipments that are delayed or mishandled by the carrier (airlines or FedEx)
3) No live arrival guarantee for shipments sent via door to door services such as FedEx
4) No live arrival guarantee on shipments sent to destinations below 40(f) degrees or above 89(f) degrees
5) No live arrival guarantee on amphibians at anytime
6) All claims must be called in and unacceptable animals returned within 24 hours of arrival at destination airport. If you are calling after hours or on weekends leave a message stating the exact nature of your claim. Please be sure to include your name, phone number, exact nature of the problem, exact number and species involved.
7) All returned orders will be charged a restocking fee.
8) Prices are subject to change without notice.
9) The purchaser agrees to pay all expenses, including legal expenses, court costs, and attorneys fees paid by the seller in endeavoring to collect these invoiced items. All amounts over 60 days shall be subject to a 2% monthly service charge.

wow those terms are juist too crazy.

i wonder how he plans on selling any animal in mid-november to febuary.....

im also perplexed why he charges a restocking fee? a reptile shouldnt need a restocking fee...

he should just state "if the animal dies, goodluck in getting a refund"

Actually that reads like most wholesaler's TOS. Probably doesn't realize what the retail customers expect from a shipper.

Now please, bear with me that I'm not criticizing them at all. One can put whatever TOS he wants in his ads/company. Just reading them from a customer's standpoint really cools me off instantly (no puns to the current weather intended). They could have just stated "live arrival guaranteed only when shipped through airlines (with the exclusions of amphibians)". One YES and one NO. But four "NOs" in a row makes me think NO, instead of YES or maybe. Restocking fee? Prices subject to change without notice? When? After or before the order is sent? Laws, courts, attorneys, even before an order is placed? In my opinion this company has been burnt by someone, but those TOS at least scare me as a potential customer.

agreed. reading it basically states no live arrival guarantee at all.

1) Live arrival guarantee only on shipments sent airport to airport (air freight)
2) No live arrival for shipments that are delayed or mishandled by the carrier (airlines or FedEx)
3) No live arrival guarantee for shipments sent via door to door services such as FedEx
4) No live arrival guarantee on shipments sent to destinations below 40(f) degrees or above 89(f) degrees
5) No live arrival guarantee on amphibians at anytime

if you read this just right, they give a live arrival gurantee on airfright then they took it away on the 2nd one. the only true shipping option they give you us airfrieght, and even then if it was dead they seem they can possibly blame it on the shipper and use tos#2.

also, a good portion of america's night lows are getting below 40, so that voids alot of states. i can understand the need for that tos, but it makes me think they dont use heatpacks or nothing else.....

i can even understand a restocking fee applying to a reptile product or something similar, but not the reptile itself. it doesnt make scince to me. i mean a %20 fee to unpack the reptile and put it back in its cage is kinda odd...............

9) The purchaser agrees to pay all expenses, including legal expenses, court costs, and attorneys fees paid by the seller in endeavoring to collect these invoiced items. All amounts over 60 days shall be subject to a 2% monthly service charge.

this part honestly scares and confuses me at the same time. i wouldnt understand why this tos was even needed to begin with.

like alvaro said, from looking at it from a potential customer standpoint i would just walk away. no matter what they were selling. it just looks to me if i had a problem, i would get zero help from these people.

Why do you think that a restocking fee is not a problem on a reptile product but is a problem on a reptile? Reptiles are actually harder to deal with. An employee costs $15 - $18 per hour ($7 for his pay and the rest for insurance, taxes, benefits etc). Figure it takes him 1/2 hour to deal with your return. That's $10. Longer if it's multiple animals.

Caging and space doesn't stay dormat (especially at a wholesalers which this tos looks like). Caging has to cleaned and set up for the returned animal.

We as sellers take a huge risk when we ship an animal to a customer. This is why animals sold retail are usually 2 - 3 times what they are wholesale.

I agree that you have to give up a lot of the protection in that tos to make sales happen as most retail customers don't like those terms. Just the nature of doing business in a risky industry.

Daniel,

Ok, you have a point on the restocking issue. What I really believe will scare prospective buyers away is the non-gurantee live arrival except by airlines. And even if that point is an issue (as "bringerofdoom" pointed out), refer to TOS #2. In short what I read from their TOS is: No guarantee for a live arrival whatsoever, plus some "key words" that make me nervous such as, price change w/o notice, attorneys, laws, and courts.

Regards.

I agree those terms would scare away customers at a retail level.

Those are very similiar to what I've read on various wholesalers list. It sounds like the person you saw with those terms doesn't understand the mindset of a retail customer. Probaby either a wholesaler trying to branch into a new market area or one of those "employees/friends/etc of a wholesaler" who basically just resale from the wholesalers location.

Personally, that TOS doesn't bother me that much. The live arrival guarantee, though written out in 4 seperate points, seems to me to be not too out of the ordinary. Many breeders I've dealt with have those same temperature parameters. I pretty much shut down shipping of orders for 2-3 months of the winter. Even shippers that allow you to ship (e.g. delta) and supposedly let you insure the snake, rarely will honor the insurance for a snake. Therefore, if you look at some of the other breeders, many of them also note that if it is the shippers fault (delayed, mishandled, etc.) that it is not covered.

Part number 9? he's just putting in writing, what I would think most people already know, that being.. if "I" have to go after you to collect, you should be responsible for my costs to come after "you".

The thing that would probably deter me though, is a restocking fee, I also don't like that catchall "shipping AND handling". I only will pay actual shipping charges. Probably not so much with us in the reptile business, but many big companies make a huge chunk of money with their "handling" charges, just like with all the banks making major bank ( sorry) with all their misc. charges. The only time I think that a restocking fee might be appropriate was if I bought a snake, computer, whatever, and then decided I wanted to return it because I changed my mind.
If I'm returning the product for a "valid" reason, like it wasn't feeding (per guarantee), defective, price guarantee or whatever, I don't think a restocking fee is warranted.
JMO

If I'm returning the product for a "valid" reason, like it wasn't feeding (per guarantee), defective, price guarantee or whatever, I don't think a restocking fee is warranted.

John,

I agree 100% with you on what you said in the quote.

As far as the live arrival guarantee goes, as a customer what I like to see in a post is "live arrival guaranteed". That gives puts me at ease even though I know there is always room for mishaps. If throughout all his TOS the seller states he will not guarantee a live animal, why would someone decide to purchase from him?

We all know accidents happen. But they should be exceptions and handled as such. As far as temperature goes I have the same statement in my TOS. In fact I have a shipment on hold until Tuesday because temps are on the 30's right now. But a "blanket" no live-arrival-guarantee if shipped through carriers regardless of temperatures? If as a seller one feels so unease about the security of his shipment using UPS for example, then don't use it!

My main concern with those TOS was just from a customer's perspective. All of us buyers want to receive a live animal. Although we understand accidents happen, we need reassurance that we are backed-up by a certain guarantee. When we ship we are always worried until we hear the animals reached their final destination alive and well.

In my opinion it would have been far better to say "Live arrival only guaranteed when animals are shipped Delta", than to spell-out all the other non-guaranteed options.

Best regards.