Holy Crap - Someone Died

Originally Posted by KNOBTAIL

Juvenile. I DONT THINK SO. Lets just say its your lack of understanding that most attornies would advise their client to hold off on any payments to anyone until they see what direction this suit is going to take.... Not as juvenile as you think !

Seriously? Just because YOU think that Ben will get sued and YOU think he may declare bankruptcy because of something completely unrelated to your issue with him, is sufficient grounds for you to use that as an excuse to not pay him the money that is allegedly owed by you to him?

That is now your excuse of the moment?

Sorry Jerry, but unless bankruptcy law has changed substantially, I believe a bankruptcy does not absolve any debts owed TO the person or business declaring bankruptcy. Your debt to him would have to be declared in court proceedings and be considered as a pending asset of Ben's estate but it does NOT go away.

I am so upset hurt and shocked by the things Jerry has written about me, my family and my manager and his family. It has caused much emotional suffering at this point as I am sure that EVERYONE on this thread would agree. Someone email me saying that very traumatic libelous events can cause many disorders such as ptsd and others. I sure hope Jerry is happy for what he has done and the damage both emotional and financial to me and my business. I am also very upset that he would post untrue facts about an event that he did not attend and knew nothing about. That is also a shame, as If I am not mistaken but presenting fact publicly knowing they are not true about an ongoing investigation is a felony? I could be wrong, but wouldnt Jerrys prior career as a law enforcement officer make him even more culpable then say an average citizen.... but hey---what do I know---I dont understand all that legal mumbo jumbo stuff.

Bankruptcy provides protection from creditors. Its that simple. In this case, Ben will be sued. Probably the store as well. One way or another. This is just a question of time. Not sure about his manager but if a deposition is requested, for sure Billy will have to be represented.

People should not be surprised once the M.E.s report comes in and the toxocology will tell the story.. I am certain that the plaintiffs already have an attorney , just waiting for the report before they file.. Ben already has an attorney , which he did mention by name... That is not going to be of any value in these cases. Settlement will.. I can assume Ben does NOT have the necessary insurance to cover this kind of a catastrophie.

Even if he did, he will still be liable. I think we both know that insurance companies alwasys have a wiggle room especially if these types of circuses are after normal business hours. Or do you find midnight acceptable.

I dont know if Ben is incorporated or not, but even if he is, personal liabillity is always involved in a suit to insure all the cards are covered....

My post here has absolutely nothing to do with the difficulties between Ben and myself.

I have not done any thing to subterfuge my concerns that relate to this situation... I am just tired of these antics and they are not limited to Ben alone.

This is what happens when you try to outsmart yourself in a trade that already has its share of problems...Not only nationally but state wide as well...

You know Rich I have been in this business for almost 50 years. I was there at the beginning. We never had to have a gimmick to make money. Here we had a snake offering. At the expense of a persons death. Leaving two children fatherless... Mind you, Bens attraction was even advertised...

I dont doub for a second that there are regrets abound in the Siegel family, but if you think my condemnation is severe, wait until the matter gets into the hands of attornies representing the plaintiffs.. Those people you can genuily call roaches because they will check every facit of the Siegels life looking for assets, hidden funds, or self servicing changes on deeds, etc.

I know what I am talking about.



If the threat of bankruptcy looms an alternative for Ben will be to file papers, which his lawyer will do and that will become effective upon notification to the courts... Everything will stop.(dead in its tracks) any litigation or future litigation on this wrongful death situation.

then his attorney will advise him , if he has not done so to hold on to any cash, pay only necessary bills and see where this will lead.. It is also very possible that the attornys represnting the plantiff will try and block the bankruptcy proceddings by pleading before a judge... This is just my opinion, but its a bit premature at this time..

Just to clarify your misconception about bankruptcies. once filed. Everything stops. College loans, allimony , and possibly tax obligations will not be immune .. Also you can be damn sure that his tax returns will be examined to see if there are any assets outside of the business. Like a home, boat, etc...


I came here to discuss this situation because Bens action can be damaging to the food industry as well.... I dont understand what was so necessary about this type of entertainment, could provide..

if Ben has some problems with my posts, that his problem. I dont need nor do any breeder of insects need any additional problems with authorities who would like nothing better than to control or eliminate food suppliers to the trade. That would be the Dept of Agriculture and here in Fla they are worse than the F&W people... So I am concerned..

. His problems with me have nothing to do with his own problems here....

Rich, I suggest you re check what you think is correct about bankruptcies and you will see that I happen to be correct.... There is one caviat.

Becuase of the amount of the suit (undetermined as yet) state bankruptices have limitations (money wise) this will be federal . JERRY

Originally Posted by KNOBTAIL

I came here to discuss this situation because Bens action can be damaging to the food industry

Uh huh, sure you did
Jerry, no one believes that, no one believes you, and I would think that many are tired of your blunt, bullying manner.
You've looked up just enough to be able to speak a few words on a few legal theories. but pointedly, you are not addressing the theories that may be applied to your own situation. You are here to deflect attention from your own predicament, which you brought upon yourself.

Originally Posted by KNOBTAIL

I am certain that the plaintiffs already have an attorney , just waiting for the report before they file.. [/b]Ben already has an attorney , which he did mention by name...

Exactly! And that is exactly who should be concerned about all the crap you keep spewing! You have no dog in THIS race Jerry!

Originally Posted by KNOBTAIL

Bankruptcy provides protection from creditors. Its that simple. In this case, Ben will be sued. Probably the store as well. One way or another. This is just a question of time. Not sure about his manager but if a deposition is requested, for sure Billy will have to be represented.

You have insider information that you're sharing on a public forum now? Really? Unless you know something we don't, making outright statements like he "WILL" be sued "one way or another" is really presumptuous of you. Not everyone is a sue-happy asshole.

If I took a known risk doing something to try to get something I wanted, if I died involved in the hobby I loved, because *I* chose to take a risk that turned out poorly in my favor, and ESPECIALLY if I, while of sound mind and body, signed a WAIVER, I've made it clear as HELL to my loved ones that I'd haunt them for freaking eternity if they sued ANYONE for my dumb choice.

Originally Posted by KNOBTAIL

My post here has absolutely nothing to do with the difficulties between Ben and myself.

Oh, so it's not cowardice that keeps you posting here, so you can avoid having to explain the skidmarks on all your recent dirty laundry that's flapping in the wind? You must not have been much of a cop. They're generally much more effective liars.

Originally Posted by KNOBTAIL

I came here to discuss this situation because Bens action can be damaging to the food industry as well....

That glass house is nothing more than a frame, at this point. Ripping people off is so much more admirable, in regards to protecting and promoting the hobbby? Good luck selling that one.

Here's a little integrity test for you. Since critical thinking clearly isn't one of your strengths, I'll make it multiple choice.

Complete this statement:

Shady business practices, such as reneging on promised refunds, are _______ to how any niche industry is perceived.

a) beneficial
b) harmful
c) baba booey!

I'm not a lawyer or a judge, but Jerry seems to think his opinion on the matter is as good as fact. Just so we're all on the same page, here are the actual facts as we know them:

1. Ben advertises cockroach eating contest on Facebook
2. People show up at his store
3. Ben has the contestants sign a waiver absolving himself and the store of any responsibility in the proceedings
4. Only one person out of all the contestants had any complications from the contest

That, so far, is it. And do you think places would even make you sign a waiver like this if the legality of it wasn't certain? What would be the point? When I took a motorcycle course from the MSF, they made everyone sign a waiver saying that if you got hurt and/or died, they weren't responsible. It's your own fault when you do dangerous stuff, whether it be riding motorcycles or participating in eating contests.

There will be a lawsuit and Ben will have more difficulties that anyone could imagine. I know because I was involved in these types of litigation.

There are attorneys that specialize in these matters, and are experts in winning for the plaintiff... THIS IS BIG MONEY HERE. Although I dont know how much it could be in the millions.

For those who seem to follow me around, by doing so it just makes Bens problems more problematic. He does not need or should even be posting here as this is about a BOI thread .. If you dont like the posting , then refrain from bringing in a BOI thread here...

Or possibly the moderator can do something about it... Its always the same people, with the same argument.

To Ben Siegel. From the onset everything is always a" poor me ". syndrome. you took private emails that I sent you, created a BOI thread and attempted to ridicule me publicly. With the help of the same people who have now come here to continue on an unrelated matter, It still continues.

I hold your responsible for your dogs because they wear your collars. Just like Exotics of Miami. Another Ben Siegel special. Then all of a sudden after almost 1 1/2 years a second thread appears on the BOI over a $ 36.00 replacement issue. Coincidence Ben !

I have been on the BOI since its infancy. Never had a problem concerning herps . Got into plenty of arguments , without calling people liars, and bringing in an army to defend poor Ben and making it appear that I am to blame for all of your ills... You are responsible for your own actions. Not me

You contact me privately and I responded. You then felt is was so importaint to create a thread " the worst kind" For what Ben !


You let other people do your dirty work until I respond and then I am a thief, You never even provided me with an invoice, You dont even know the date of the transaction;;;;You coulld have stopped this and you did not. You purposely waited unitl I responded to your private emails and then made it a public fiasco . That is reprehensible, and unforgiven .

So I left and came here to discuss a different situation that does affect me and possibly allot of other peoples business as well... Did it ever dawn on you that maybe the DOA will start examining stores that do breed roaches or receive crickets, mealworms, etc and may have to now meet certain criteras because of your stupidy with your gimmick enterprise....

Why should I have to bare any burden or anyone else . My buisness is 21 years old. I dont need any additional supervision from outside sources.. This is something that you have created out of your own ignorance , without thinking about any ramifications that could not be beneficial.. A big party for Ben Siegel and friends. At the store at midnight..


Be smart, stop posting here, and allow this thread to die down hopefully as the other ones that you started on the BOI have done... I strongly suggest the same for your patron to follow suit.


These litigations are not only very expensive but very painful. I understand that. Most of the people whom I saw involved in these situations end up in bankruptcy protection. Its the least expensive avenue as you cannot fight it because of your limited funds which go beyond enormous.

Your attorney will advise you accordingly. The information that I have provided is more than an opinion , its a fact based on my own experiences through law enforment.

Although unrelated to this unusual case, most of them get resolved in some settlement or protection from the court, but you do loose !

You will.... regardless of the MEs report which more than likely will show some poison killed the poor soul.. As indicated earlier. more than likely a body reaction of sorts. FORTUNATELY that the other contestents were lucky enough to avoid.

Enough said. Leave me alone.

Originally Posted by KNOBTAIL

The information that I have provided is more than an opinion , its a fact based on my own experiences through law enforment.
.

LEOs are not attorneys. You have no expertise in the legal field, and while you are as entitled as the next man to your opinion, your opinion is no more than just that.

Originally Posted by KNOBTAIL

Or possibly the moderator can do something about it...

Are you REALLY calling on the moderators for personal help after you smarted off to Rich on the fruitfly thread? Really?

The reasons you are beginning to get upset about many of these posts and desperately trying to put the hush on, is that your bullying tactics have flat out failed and it is dawning on you that you are facing the possible loss of a lot of money because of your own words and actions.