Heavy parasite load found in ball python from Ed Clark

Well I just came back to clear one thing up. I know the difference between Captive Hatched or Captive Born and Captive Bred and Born. Considering we have both. I have hatched out babies from a WC Female that came in gravid. Those are Captive Hatched. What I was saying is exactly what Gary said. A WC Female that came in or Captive Hatched female for that matter that was raised up and bred to a spider, mojave or a codom male or anything really. Lots of people do this. I know for a fact Ed gets in the WC Adults and hatches out the eggs if there is any and I bet he has holdbacks from that clutch of eggs that he raises up and breeds. He might even keep the mother if something cool came out of the clutch. Then Bred her again in a couple years. Lots of People do this. I am unsure exactly where the particular ball pythons came from as I am not Ed. But I hope this makes it clear to well WES. I thought I made it clear the first time but guess not. So all I was saying is what if the Ball Pythons that Emily got were from a WC or CH mother bred to a codom and she got the normal holdback females from the clutch.

Originally Posted by JudyC

Bill? That's a new one. Sometimes I get called "dude" when people don't pay attention to the name attached to all my posts....but that's the first time I've ever been called "Bill."

No...I don't have many posts here. I have my own forum to run and other than following the current threads on the BOI, I don't have the time or the inclination to participate in other forums.

I'm involved in this one because I know and care about the people involved and feel I have enough understanding and information about both parties to provide something useful to this discussion.

Judy Clothier
JLC -- Administrator, Ball-Pythons.net

Like Bud, he just gets paranoid when anyone has anything to say about his wonderful circle of allies/friends.

Anthony Allis
ExoticsExpress@aol.com

Emily I have no reason to disbelieve you, though I wonder why you made a post here rather than in the Ball forum on this and other sites you visit.

I'm with Kelli on this one, I don't think this thread would be going this way if the person's name in the title were different ETC ETC

Tapeworms well we've had it said here that they can be missed in a exam and now more speculation has the mother being WC and well heck maybe she had two heads!! come on folks unless Ed says something about the sire and Dam we haven't a clue.

Ed, we've had some differences in the past but I think you know me to be fair when looking at things like this.. So come on post some Vet reports. I know it's possible you have had test done without a report, my vet does the same thing when testing a number of animals to save time and paperwork and well some bucks as well. Might be an idea to take 8 or 10 in have them tested and post the results and most of all say something here, your silence isn't helping you. you don't have to address anyone here but Emily but say something... Randy

Bud, who is this "We" you are talking about? Your "We" seems to be the minority here.

You shouldn't be attacking people who are just bringing facts to light about Ed's practices. No one has said anything about being an "Ed Hater" other than you.

Keep to the subject at hand...
Parasites in an infected snake that was purchased from Ed Clark.

Not petty bickering.

Most internal parasites are transmitted by ingestion (not casual contact), and infected feeder animals, or fecally contaminated food or water (depending on the organism in question) are the usual vectors of transmission. Tapeworms, specifically, have an indirect lifecycle, and consequently require an intermediate host in order to infect a new organism. Transmission is the result of the ingestion of an infected intermediate host (i.e. an infected rodent in the case of a ball python). There is no such thing as a tapeworm that can only live in reptiles, as there has to be an intermediate host. Neither are tapeworms transmitted from one animal to another in a collection...it just doesn't work like that.

Absolutely correct and I'm glad you posted this.

Originally Posted by ravensgait

Emily I have no reason to disbelieve you, though I wonder why you made a post here rather than in the Ball forum on this and other sites you visit.

I'm with Kelli on this one, I don't think this thread would be going this way if the person's name in the title were different ETC ETC

I DID make a thread about this on ball-pythons.net--that is thread that Kelli is talking about where she disagrees with my having posted Ed's name.

I don't normally post on the forums here and the only other forums I frequent are gecko forums. Why would I post anything in those places? Why is this not exactly the place for this type of post?

I just want to add this food for thought: I know of instances where reptiles in a zoo collection were parasite free for years and then one day tested positive for some parasite or another. This particular zoo practices the strictest of quarantines and before a new animal is even put in the same building as the main collection it is tested multiple times by qualified vets and kept in isolation for many weeks or months. It happens sometimes.

Originally Posted by Dr Owens

This is not a very accurate statement, and it has been stated more than once in this topic. While there are a few parasites that could potentially be transmitted from mother to baby, tapeworms specifically would not be one of them.

Additionally, the incidence of maternal-fetal transmission of all parasites (while I doubt that it has ever been studied) has got to be unbelievably low...especially in pythons (as opposed to boas that bear live young, and hence are internally incubated by the mother).

Most internal parasites are transmitted by ingestion (not casual contact), and infected feeder animals, or fecally contaminated food or water (depending on the organism in question) are the usual vectors of transmission. Tapeworms, specifically, have an indirect lifecycle, and consequently require an intermediate host in order to infect a new organism. Transmission is the result of the ingestion of an infected intermediate host (i.e. an infected rodent in the case of a ball python). There is no such thing as a tapeworm that can only live in reptiles, as there has to be an intermediate host. Neither are tapeworms transmitted from one animal to another in a collection...it just doesn't work like that.

thanks for clearing this up. this proves that there is no way this snake could have gotten tapeworms after it entered my collection.

Originally Posted by KelliH

I just want to add this food for thought: I know of instances where reptiles in a zoo collection were parasite free for years and then one day tested positive for some parasite or another. This particular zoo practices the strictest of quarantines and before a new animal is even put in the same building as the main collection it is tested multiple times by qualified vets and kept in isolation for many weeks or months. It happens sometimes.

So... maybe this snake contracted tapeworms, strongyloides and coccidia randomly out of nowhere...?

emily I take it you do feed F/T I do not want to assume but just a question.

Has Ed answered you about what he sent. I know he said in the emails before the trade that they were CBB. But here he states he does not remember. Has he said anything at all anywhere that he may have sent WC or CH?

And do not let anything get to you here. People are just asking questions and probing about. I know it can get upsetting at times. In the end most of the time it works out.

Just hope everything goes well with your snakes