What would you do if you got sent IBD?

The reference material that everyone is looking at is 1985, we have made some advances in the last 17 years. Sure we do not have the vaccine but we do have the test. My Vet charges $110 and it takes about 2 weeks for results. I have been lucky so far and try to buy my Boas from people who also have pythons.

This is a copy of an e-mail I got from CFRB

Quote-Eddie,
Not to be an ass but the paper you are using as reference is
is 1985. We have come a long way in 17 years if you need a vet to do a liver biopsy just call a good reptile vet.
Chuck

When I asked about newer material, this is the reply I recieved


Quote-Its a live check call your Vet.
Chcuk


I called my vets, they said there isn't a 'conclusive ' live test,
Probably won't be for a number of years and if you trust your vet to make a biopsy of a living snakes liver or otherwise, then you are going to wind up with mis-information, a dead snake and scammed by your vet.
The only 'conclusive' test that ANY of the vets in my area are aware of is a post mortem biopsy, and trust me, we got some vets here that are great, young and fresh out of school at the emergency hospital.

So once again, I ask you here and not by e-mail,where can we ALL find the info, or can we get the # or e-mail, for your vet so that we CAN learn more of this 100% incureable, 100% mortality
rate disease?<img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/wink.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt=''>

</span><table border="0" align="center" width="95%" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tr><td>Quote </td></tr><tr><td id="QUOTE">I have been lucky so far and try to buy my Boas from people who also have pythons.</td></tr></table><span id='postcolor'>

Wouldn't it make sense that if the breeders you go to are following the proper quarentine procedures to begin with, that it shouldn't matter what else they keep, breed, sell, give away, trade or other?

In other words, it wouldn't make a difference whether they have pythons or not.

Then again, you gots to be very trusting to go with their word on whether or not they lost any pythons to IBD, they are in for $$$, not for the sake of the animals, hence the massive need for rescues.

I feel for Chris in this situation,even though he didn't follow correct Quarentine procedures. The fact remains he was sent poor sick animals. Chris has gone through alot of stress time & money throught this ordeal & will be stressed out about if for many months to come to see if any of his other animals were infected (even though bad husbandry would be only reason this could happen). The last time the seller of the IBD animals in question here had a problem on BOI he came to defend himself. Where is he at now? I see still selling snakes.
Just my thoughts on the situation.
Chris Pearson

Hey Chris,
&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;Have you contacted Bill Cagle since you found out for sure that it is IBD?<img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'>?<img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'>?? &nbsp;And if so what did he say???
&nbsp; &nbsp;Tom

yes...

I need some questions answered

What date did you receive the snakes.

What date did bill send you a replacement.

What date did you take it to the vet.

What date did it die.

What date did bill send you more snakes.

What date did you take it back to the vet

I need a step by step date thing.

I will have to think about that....for the most part with in one month...I'll get back on all the dates

As far as IBD, Our collection was hit with it about a year ago or more........we had purchased 2 large RTBs from a local guy who had got them as a rescue. &nbsp;We needed large good looking snakes for a fair display we were doing over the summer. &nbsp;We unfortunately weren't concnerned with a quarantee because we had ASSUMED that the snakes were healthy. &nbsp;Well, for the display we housed them with a smaller 1 year old boa, a large rescue we had (no tail and a REALLY bad scar on his back) and a ground boa. &nbsp;Unfortunately, 3 months later, the ground boa passed away, then the baby went......at that point, we weren't even going to wait for the vets necropsy, so we froze ALL boas we had. &nbsp;discarded the cages and everything that had ever come in contact with the boas....probes, hemos, etc. &nbsp;It was a painful experience but we weren't relying on those animals to breed for us....they were, like I said, either used for displays, rescues, or my own personal pets. &nbsp;It WAS a great emotional loss for me, but so as to not spread this disease any further, we rid ourselves of any threats of it. &nbsp;If those things had happened to breed, and we still weren't sure of their health, we MAY have sold the babies not knowing what we were doing....of course, if we had planned on breeding the boas, we would've had a necropsy done on the 2 dead snakes, just to make sure.

Now, I'm not totally positive that it was IBD, but all the symptoms were there in the 2 dead snakes.......If we do ever decide to get back into boas, we're prepared for it.

There where much more in depth posts about this "live" test for IBD so I thought since sooo many people are viewing this story that I would re-post this information here.

The closest test that can be performed on a live animal for IBD is a tissue biopsy. Taking a liver biopsy which in and of itself unless done by a VERY experienced vet can cause early death of the snake (due to numerous factors such as anesthesia, liver not functioning well and other pre-existing health issues). It is an obviously invasive and $$$expensive test. As for mouth swabs and blood test there is absolutely NO 100% test for IBD other than post-mortem necropsy. Even the liver biopsy is NOT 100% simply because only a very small sample is taken from the liver and there may not be inclusions in that particular part of the liver especially if it is a very early onset case of IBD. Unfortunately the only other way to test live animals for IBD use to be done years ago and most consider it appauling. Yep the old ball python test :^( Since ball pythons seem to be extremely susceptible to IBD then tend to die rapidly after being exposed to IBD i.e. within a month or so after exposure. Breeders use to keep ball pythons to test for IBD, I'm pretty sure it is no longer done and I hope that mentioning this won't rekindle this practice simply because they are also living animals and not a test. Not to mention that even if trying this method the dead ball python would still need to be tested for IBD so its not really a viable method. Anyway just wanted to get some more veterinary based information out there. As for how common this disease is <img src="http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/iB_html/non-cgi/emoticons/confused.gif" border="0" valign="absmiddle" alt='???'>? Your guess is as good as everyone elses, until we get a 100% viable living specimen test we will never know how common it is. Boa Constrictors do appear to be able to survive as carriers of this disease so like I said until a living test is found we will never know how common it is. What does this mean to everyone..very simple
RELIGIOUSLY practice 2 things !!!
#1 Extensive QUARANTINE procedures and
#2 Extensive almost STERILE cleaning and handling procedures within your collections !!!

There you go.
Just more information for everyone out there from the veterinary field.