Beware of Jerry Kruse

Originally Posted by JETZEN

A "PURIST" that sells "MUTTS" as "PURE" is a bad guy hypocrite and a liar. I don't know Mitch but i think he is telling the truth.
Good Luck Stu.

whoops!,

John Sommerfield

If someone has reason to attack someones character that's one thing. But certain people shouldn't throw stones when they themselves commited crimes by smuggling illegally obtained zonata and that itself if theft.

Originally Posted by rattler

If someone has reason to attack someones character that's one thing. But certain people shouldn't throw stones when they themselves commited crimes by smuggling illegally obtained zonata and that itself if theft.

Oh tell us tell more!!! You got my interest...I'm going to the fridge to get another beer. lol

Originally Posted by Rick Staub

Can somebody loan me a benchtop electron scanning microscope. Also a lab full of instruments so I can purify the prospective pathogen. It is all so easy!

Many think ZD is caused by a virus. If so you should go read some papers by Jacobson and others on IBD to see how much effort it would take to characterize a new viral pathogen. It is a non-starter.

Jeff -- asking some lab to screen samples will do nothing since you have no baseline to know whether anything they find is normal. Any screen will likely only look for bacteria (plenty of those around normally) and protozoa/flagellate type organisms. Viruses are a different game due to their much smaller size.

I certainly hope we are not criticizing Stu, or Jerry for that matter, for not being altruistic and taking on the mantel of advancing the science for this potential disease. I would be happy if they would just take good notes on their observations.

Stu -- nice shiny scales on that fifth zonata. Begs the question -- are you going to ship him back int he same box as his litter mates?

Well, lets not do it and see how many times the disease wipes out collections. Ya, smart. If no one knows what causes it WHY NOT start from the beginning and eliminate possibilities. Baseline? To start with Jerrys healthy zonata, that is the baseline. Checking swabs at every point of contact between these 2 guys could show different bugs and combinations along the way. Is there something that is present at Stu's that isnt at Jerry's? If so, thats where you start, pretty simple. Jerry is a zonata breeder with a website, Stu wants to get into Zonata and will have $3100 soon to play with. Mitch wants to be a Zonata expert, so there are 3 people to share costs, it is tax deductible! You dont need a whole lab, labs are already set up to study such things. Altruism? How about professionalism? If these guys want to make money off selling or studying zonata why not have them pay for it?? Not solely of course, pass the hat. The idea of shed skins or to sample 1 guys place and not the other is foolish. Somewhere in between lies the CAUSE of the disease.

Originally Posted by Show Me

Heck if you were to swab my door handle I'm sure it contains all kinds of nasty microbes that could be grown in a lab but that's the case with just about anyone's home. Under normal conditions most animals and people have a good immune system that can fend off most infections. I'm not sure how spending a crap load of money on the testing you suggest is going to do any good. If they had a test for zonata disease then that would be worth it but unfortunately they do not.

I dont think you understand, looking for causes for the disease and and defining the disease are 2 different things. Its not a crap load of money considering that thousands of $$ these guys will be making on the backs of Zonata!

Originally Posted by Jeff Schofield

Well, lets not do it and see how many times the disease wipes out collections. Ya, smart. If no one knows what causes it WHY NOT start from the beginning and eliminate possibilities. Baseline? To start with Jerrys healthy zonata, that is the baseline. Checking swabs at every point of contact between these 2 guys could show different bugs and combinations along the way. Is there something that is present at Stu's that isnt at Jerry's? If so, thats where you start, pretty simple. Jerry is a zonata breeder with a website, Stu wants to get into Zonata and will have $3100 soon to play with. Mitch wants to be a Zonata expert, so there are 3 people to share costs, it is tax deductible! You dont need a whole lab, labs are already set up to study such things. Altruism? How about professionalism? If these guys want to make money off selling or studying zonata why not have them pay for it?? Not solely of course, pass the hat. The idea of shed skins or to sample 1 guys place and not the other is foolish. Somewhere in between lies the CAUSE of the disease.

I am sure Stu worked hard to save $3100 to purchase these snakes and definitely has better ways to spend his money. Mitch is already a zonata expert. And if you think 3 people can share the cost to fund what you are proposing then you really do not know what you are talking about.

Originally Posted by Jeff Schofield

I dont think you understand, looking for causes for the disease and and defining the disease are 2 different things. Its not a crap load of money considering that thousands of $$ these guys will be making on the backs of Zonata!

These guys? Mitch and I have been giving zonata away for years while spending our own dollars doing natural history research on this species.

You need to stop digging!

Rick, You are a respected professional.

Jeff...? Jeff Schofield has beed exposed for sending snakes to buyers in gym socks he pulled out of his laundry hamper --- and with holes large enough for the snakes to escape, get out of of the shipping box, and get stuck to the tape on the same box.

For some comedy (you really can't make this up!) see this:
http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/foru...ad.php?t=42452

I'd just ignore him if I was you.

Originally Posted by Show Me

My guess is... Stu doesn't want to spend any more money on this snakes and I understand. Who would want to spend $3100 and then have to pay a vet when you feel the snakes were sent sick to you? Stu just wants them gone and anyone can see something is not right with them.

Yeah, Stu has other snakes though, and he might need a vet for one of those someday.

Originally Posted by Rick Staub

I am sure Stu worked hard to save $3100 to purchase these snakes and definitely has better ways to spend his money. Mitch is already a zonata expert. And if you think 3 people can share the cost to fund what you are proposing then you really do not know what you are talking about.

If he spends that much money on snakes it sounds like he is planning on making it back and more in Zonata. YES, he and Jerry and Mitch should pass a hat.

These guys? Mitch and I have been giving zonata away for years while spending our own dollars doing natural history research on this species.

You need to stop digging!

Mitch is studying Zonata right? They are the conduit which he is cutting his teeth to make a living, right? Why not ask him to kick back a portion? If someone wants to pat themselves on the back for his work with Zonata why not? What better way to continue to be a expert? Is he bettering himself or bettering Zonata?