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FaunaClassifieds Site HELP & Feedback Forum Anything of a nature concerning this website, moderators, admin, or anything having to do with how it is being run, should go here. Criticism is welcome, but abusive antagonism is not. THIS IS NOT THE FORUM FOR FEEDBACK CONCERNING BUYERS AND SELLERS! Such posts are ONLY allowed as replies to classified ads posted by the specific member involved in a specific issue with you.

View Poll Results: Should the Trader's Ratings be changed to allow ALL members to give ratings?
Yes, allow ALL registered members to give ratings. 43 40.19%
No, keep it as it is with only paying members being able to give ratings. 64 59.81%
Voters: 107. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 03-27-2015, 10:23 PM   #11
Occidentalis
Quote:
Originally Posted by WebSlave View Post
Anyone want to pitch in and find the links to the number of threads where members have made suggestions on how to change it to make it better?

Then after reviewing those threads, if someone has a suggestion that hasn't been brought up before, and subsequently shot down when real world implementation issues set in, then please have at it.
I think what you said here is the main reason it's best not to change it:

Quote:
I think this If the Trader's Ratings ARE abused, then that's just going to be the way it is. None of the staff here is going to intervene in anyone' behalf to even investigate claims of abuse, much less do anything about it. I'm not looking to set something in motion that could potentially just be a headache for the moderators and myself by constantly riding herd on the Trader's Ratings and having to clean up messes that someone may create in there. Maybe this won't really come to pass, and I really hope it doesn't but if it does, anyone complaining about the abuse is going to get nothing more than, at most, a link to this thread with the poll, and a "Sorry Charlie".

And no, I'm not going to be throwing money at custom programming to try to make the Trader's Ratings *perfect* for one person or another. This function is already a custom coding add-in here and I can't see throwing more good money after potentially bad.
If the moderators were willing to moderate it, it would probably work. Alternatively, innovative programming solutions ($$) would be required.

Since both are off the table, this isn't really something that seems worth talking about. I don't find fault with this, but it does seem like options are limited.
 
Old 03-28-2015, 12:07 AM   #12
Utta
I see no point in making mods baby sit everyone's trader rating. That would be an absurd waste of time and effort. If they were forced to do so, then a new "report abuse of trader ratings" button/thingy would also have to be put in lest mods actually click on every single person's profile and go threw every single trader rating that person has, every few days.

Sure it's not flawless... Nothing is. About everything to "make it better" has been brought up before, and the cons just outweigh the pros.

keep it as is, Rich.
 
Old 03-28-2015, 12:13 AM   #13
Occidentalis
Quote:
Originally Posted by Utta View Post
I see no point in making mods baby sit everyone's trader rating. That would be an absurd waste of time and effort. If they were forced to do so, then a new "report abuse of trader ratings" button/thingy would also have to be put in lest mods actually click on every single person's profile and go threw every single trader rating that person has, every few days.
One would assume that should an individual problem arise, the user would contact the moderators. I don't think it would be as hands-on as you describe.
 
Old 03-28-2015, 12:22 AM   #14
WebSlave
Quote:
Originally Posted by Occidentalis View Post
One would assume that should an individual problem arise, the user would contact the moderators. I don't think it would be as hands-on as you describe.
Have you found the other threads where such issues have been discussed before? This HAS all been addressed before. I just don't feel like going down that well traveled road again. It gets old after a while having to repeat myself.
 
Old 03-28-2015, 02:29 AM   #15
Dennis Hultman
Quote:
Originally Posted by Occidentalis View Post
One would assume that should an individual problem arise, the user would contact the moderators. I don't think it would be as hands-on as you describe.
Once upon a time every user could use the trader rating system. The abuse mostly occurred by someone trying to boost their own rating. They would create a shill account and give themselves positive ratings under their alias.

Then there were times that some members would claim that those giving them a bad rating never did business with them. Some claims would be that someone just trolling the forum would create account and just make up bad reviews on random accounts or someone that didn't like them created a fake account to target them.

Then you might have a user that simply is just being untruthful about doing business with you.

When we went to contributing members are higher using the trader rating system it all stopped. Someone could do it now but it would cost them $25 a user name and they would have to somehow pay without using their real name to not raise flags about the account. Since most of the problems occur from people giving themselves positive ratings it usually isn't worth it to them to pay for each fake account to bump their ratings.

Here is what needs to be considered when asking a moderator to investigate the above scenarios.

It wouldn't be to much of a stretch to moderate someone giving themselves fake ratings. We already look for people not following the rules and using bogus accounts. Creating a fake name and profile would be against the rules. It would probably add a lot more work if a lot of people start to cheat but someone would have to have some suspicions of someone doing it to bring it to our attention.

For the most part the cheats will probably go unnoticed unless they bring attention to themselves. Have a Bad BOI thread or something that catches someones attention and we have a reason to look at their ratings.

The trader ratings being wide open to all will probably boost the numbers of those that deserve the positive ratings but there will be a lot less verification of the numbers. Negative ratings will go up as well.

That would be a lot easier to deal with then the other type of abuse.

What happens if we open it up wide tomorrow and someone gives you a bad trader rating and you have never heard of them or dealt with them before?

As with the BOI the site itself doesn't judge the guilt or innocence of anyone.
The site itself doesn't decide who is telling the truth. The site gives you the tools and asks you to follow the rules.

What if the person just registered and put a negative feedback on your rating and then never posts or comes back to the site?

If you tell me it is bogus how am I suppose to know? You are putting us in a position to just accept your word. Not knowing if it is someone just spamming the site, someone who just doesn't like a comment you made in a forum or if you really did have a bad transaction with the person. I'm not going to delete it.

Sure it can happen with contributing members too but what's really the likelihood when they have paid for account with a name attached to it that they would actually spam the trader ratings with bogus information for people they never did business with? Someone just registering on the site under a fake name would be more likely.

There is a little more of a verification with the ratings as it is now.

Everyone can post on the BOI. They can give positive ratings, negative ratings and debate what is posted. All members can comment there and weigh the information within the threads.

The trader rating system is only for people that have done business with that individual. Being somewhat verified as a real person by paying for that privilege I believe is a better route. Those that contribute to the site have more of a vested interest in following the rules and if they don't, their name is on it for all to see.

Disputes will still arise and people will not agree on their transactions but we won't have to deal with fake ratings from fake profiles.

As Robert stated, is it really that much? Everyone can posts ads on this site for free. Everyone can participate on this site for free. Everyone can leave positive and negative feedback on this site for free on the BOI for every user. Everyone can socialize, make friends, discuss topics that interest them for free.

There are some things that contributing members to the site have the ability to do as a perk that also benefits them and the site. My personal opinion is that the trader rating system should stay as one of those benefits.
 
Old 03-28-2015, 03:56 AM   #16
WebSlave
Sheesh... I had completely forgotten that I have already run a poll of this nature a couple of years ago -> http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/foru...d.php?t=448995

Wonder how many more times I have done so in the past (and will again in the future)?


Which, of course, also means that the people who keep on bringing this issue up aren't checking here in the Feedback Forum for previous discussions about this thing neither.
 
Old 03-28-2015, 01:47 PM   #17
tegusonly
There are those who will use talk forums and sites like this as attack platforms.
In many cases they are aligned with a competitors business (or an actual competitor).
The intent is to drive business away from the target business and frequently directs
the reader to 'good' business of their choosing. When such tactics are employed,
The person/s doing so, can make up allegations, post phony pictures, and basically
say anything they want without evidence to support it, knowing there are no real
world consequences to doing so. There is very little that a person or business
under attack can do to stop it. The person reading this kind of bashing has no
way of knowing if it is true or not.

The Herp world is a community made of great people with a common bond.
There are, however, a few bad apples that can do serious damage
with bad intent and a keyboard.

Truth exists, Only falsehoods need be invented.
 
Old 03-28-2015, 09:34 PM   #18
Snake-Queen
Quote:
Originally Posted by nickolasanastasiou View Post
If left open, I believe it will be severely abused to bash competitors via fake registrations as well as people with whom disgruntled individuals have personal issues not related to business transactions.

I also believe skin in the game in the form payment/contribution helps deter the above mentioned forms of abuse to some degree. I have difficulty conceptualizing a flawless system, so I prefer it as it is.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Occidentalis View Post
I'd say change it if the mods were willing to investigate/babysit. Leave it if they aren't - the consequences of someone screwing around with it are too dire.
I don't see any reason why more work should be added to the mods.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Utta View Post
I see no point in making mods baby sit everyone's trader rating. That would be an absurd waste of time and effort.
EXACTLY


Quote:
Originally Posted by WebSlave View Post
Sheesh... I had completely forgotten that I have already run a poll of this nature a couple of years ago -> http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/foru...d.php?t=448995

Wonder how many more times I have done so in the past (and will again in the future)?


Which, of course, also means that the people who keep on bringing this issue up aren't checking here in the Feedback Forum for previous discussions about this thing neither.
The answer continues to be the same, leave it as it is.

If non paying members want to leave trader ratings, then they can spend $25 like the ones that do. Same with the negative Karma. No reason to change it because a few are unhappy or stingy.
 
Old 03-28-2015, 11:57 PM   #19
hhmoore
I still think moderator votes should count x5 in things like this...which would make the count 7 in favor of change, and 39 opposed.
 
Old 03-29-2015, 12:09 AM   #20
WebSlave
Quote:
Originally Posted by hhmoore View Post
I still think moderator votes should count x5 in things like this...which would make the count 7 in favor of change, and 39 opposed.
If I thought that this change would affect your workload, I would have put this poll to you all first, and you would have all had to be unanimously for it.
 

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