LLLReptile should be closed down (BuyerBeware)

Originally Posted by LLLReptile

Always love when someone titles a thread for any breeder or company like this based on their one personal experience. Everyone is welcome to their opinions, but jeez - tone it down a notch! It's ridiculous to take it that far regardless of the situation.

I haven't dealt with this specific situation, so I am only answering in general here as Curtis or Kate at our warehouse would have been helping this person out. Bottom line is, we thoroughly go over animals when we ship. As much as humanly possible. We ship a large amount of animals out each week, and for the rare cases like this that arise, we are talking a 99.9% rate of happy customers. We do deal with live animals, and mistakes can certainly happen sometimes, no matter how thorough we are. On this captive bred boa, is it possible something was missed? Sure - we are human, and anything is possible no matter how many safety nets we have in place. Is it possible it happened elsewhere? Sure, but let's just assume for this conversation that it was missed on our end so there is no argument there. I firmly believe the emails show that we have gone above and beyond offering to take care of the situation. I am not a big fan of *most vets. Not all, but most. Some vets are unbelievably amazing for reptiles. But honestly, 98% of vets don't see enough reptiles in a given year to gain enough hands on experience needed to properly diagnose and treat anything more than outward abrasions. I have been doing this for 20 years, and any serious breeder or dealer who has done this for long enough knows this is a fact. When you find a great reptile vet (we are lucky to have several in our area), stick with them. With that being said, when there are issues that arise, we would prefer the animal come back to us so we can take care of it. We have proper medications on hand, and the experience and know-how to deal with most anything that comes up. Beyond that, if you are going to take it on yourself, then there is literally nothing more we can offer than the full credit. I think what was offered was above and beyond fair. I am very sorry for your issues. Truly. We, and I personally, care an enormous amount about the animals. They are our passion. They got us into this business, and every one of our 40+ employees love what they do, and are here for the animals. If something was missed, we really do try to provide the best possible customer service when issues arise. But unlike a broken television that can simply be replaced, animals with an issue cause a passionate response that can be tough to overcome. I respect that, but certainly ask that you take a look at it from a different perspective. Curtis, the rest of our staff and myself take this seriously, and really do our best.

Lastly. To the Beaked Snake individual. I realize (and realized when you initially had your issues), that your situation will never be resolved. Rufous Beaked Snakes are pretty easy for imports (even though we do post that imported warning someone else copied and pasted to point that out to you that there is a risk). They feed well, do well, and you went 0 for 3. That does suck. It sucks for you, and sucks for us that we replaced animals with ones that clearly were doing great here, but apparently for whatever reason, didn't for you. I would move on to if I were you and not order a single thing from us. We did everything within our realm to try to rectify the situation, as you know, and unfortunately, for whatever reason, it simply didn't work out and nothing we were going to do was going to turn your attitude around. I really do wish you luck elsewhere.

Our offer for credit to the OP here absolutely stands, and I hope we speak with you on the phone tomorrow to get a more personal conversation established. Email is just really impersonal. Thanks for your time.

Scott Wesley
LLLReptile & Supply

Well there it is people you make the decision on this company for your self.You can read their guarantee and decide for your self if you would order a animal here. They say they care for the animals, but read the emails not once was I asked about the animal before I brought it up in my email. And they have suggested I send the animal back sick and currently being treated even after I spent my own personal money on it. I took it to a professional reptile vet and they are trying to say they are better than most vets. This company wins no matter what, they need shut down plain and simple. You read it right here folks they thoroughly went over a snake with mouth rot and mites and still sent it to me. I am sure a lot more people have been in this same situation that just will set back and not say nothing the animal dies and they move. So all in all this snake got mites and mouth rot in less than 18 hours in a shipping box. If that's what you want to believe I guess they will keep on winning.

Originally Posted by CwnAnnwn

Just a warning, I am still on pain killers and can not sleep because of the pain. Got a month before this knee is replaced and pieces of bone are grinding in the joint. It feels like broken glass. It puts me in a very bad mood. Just a warning.

Second warning, I have never bought anything from lllreptile. I have inquired about some animals, but something always screamed NO!!! RUN!!!! RUN LIKE THEY GOT A KNIFE!!!!

I just want to make this clear.

You are demanding all the following?

1.) You keep the animal.
2.) You are refunded in cash for the animal and shipping for the animal.
3.) You are refunded for all vet bills until the animal is healthy.

Correct?

No Sir my first offer was to keep the animal and get a refund of the animal and mite treatment.

Or keep the animal and they pay the vet bill.

Or keep the animal and in store credit of the vet bill and some mite treatment

none of which they was willing to do at first.They only wanted to give me in store credit of 199.99. the price of the animal and wash their hands clean of this situation.

Which can be seen in the emails I posted

Originally Posted by sidewinder107

No Sir my first offer was to keep the animal and get a refund of the animal and mite treatment.

Or keep the animal and they pay the vet bill.

Or keep the animal and in store credit of the vet bill and some mite treatment

none of which they was willing to do at first.They only wanted to give me in store credit of 199.99. the price of the animal and wash their hands clean of this situation.

Which can be seen in the emails I posted

and the mite treatment on the last one to

Originally Posted by sidewinder107

You can read their guarantee and decide for your self if you would order a animal here. They say they care for the animals, but read the emails...

I'll tell you what, I've never ordered from them before, but I'm more inclined to now after seeing how well they put up with a nightmare customer like you who refuses to chill out and resolve things with them. Things eventually go wrong for everyone if you're in this business long enough, but it's how you resolve them that matters. They've done more than what's reasonable to resolve this, you just refuse to accept their offers. I still don't understand why you're unwilling to send the snake back if you're so unsatisfied.

If you still think their attempts to make things right are so bad, give this a try: Go to Walmart and buy something that's broken. Go back the next day and demand a refund (make it easy and say you'll take store credit), but tell them you aren't willing to give the item back. Tell them you'll fix the broken item yourself, but you want them to pay for your repairs. If you still think it's just bad customer service, attempt the same thing at other stores until you get the results you want. I bet you'll be trying an awfully long time before you find someone who will treat you the way you seem expect to be treated.

Originally Posted by MCMB-2

So basically there is no way to satisfy you. Add one to the list...

^^^^This! At least that is what I am getting from this thread...
~Beau

And I never once made any demands only what I suggested I would be happy with. I was as nice as I could be considering the situation. The way I see it they pawned a problem of theirs off on me. If they would have told me the animal was sick after I paid for it. I would have had no problem waiting till it was healthy for them to ship it.As you can see in all the emails I put the animal first. How many more people do you know what will go that far for their animals even a new addition???? I even said in one of my emails this was a employees over looked mistake and I feel I should not be the one to pay for it, I don't work there I can not see the animal in person. Do you think an employee is going to step up to the plate and take responsibility for this mistake and loose their job?? I will put this out there right now for the whole community to see if they will step up to the plate and admit right here they sent this animal like this to me.I will not take one dime from them from a refund. I don't care about the money I care about the animal.

If it's all about the animal and you don't care about the money then why do you keep saying you won't be happy till they pay the vet bill?

Ok. Just trying to find out what would make you happy.

The second question.

If I bought a boa off you and when I got it I claimed that it had a respiratory infection, would you let me keep the animal and refund my money in cash?

You see how this turns into the world of give me free stuff because I am willing to say anything, right? The animal you received is clearly sick, but does that give you the right to a free animal?

If the animal arrived dead, you are still in the same boat. You bought the animal under TOS that clearly states store credit. I don't know a single breeder and/or seller that will give you cash back and let you keep the animal. I could be wrong. Allowing a person to get cash back and a keep the animal does not make both parties whole. It allows one party to punish the other. Because one party is out both cash and animal. The other party receives cash and animal.


The answer that everyone is trying to tell you is this...

You are not allowed to get more then you paid to them because they made a mistake.

Negotiations can not allow anyone party to try to punish the other for personal gain. You are seeking personal gain. Store credit allows them to eat less of the cost of the animal because of retail mark up. Given the mark up for the animal and the mark up for retail goods you are buying, they are out money, but not the full amount. The are probably out the same amount has it would cost to treat the problem. You get to have the animal plus get free stuff for their mistake. And for most of us, that is fair. But to demand that animal and cash is exploitive. And given the dishonest people (not you) out there, they would quickly go out of business. Everyone would get a sick snake and demand cash.

You agreed to the TOS by buying the animal in question. The TOS clearly states if there was a problem, you would accept store credit. You also agreed that you would only receive the price of the animal. If you thought this was not acceptable, then you should have never bought the animal from them.

Now, you want to know what I would do?

I would take the store credit. I would ask for it in a gift card and give it to a local reptile rescue. I would never have given this a second thought after I dropped off the gift card.

I would write this whole thing off as a lesson learned and just move on. Because life is too wonderful to run around pounding keyboards demanding people see it your way.

Originally Posted by hurreckon

I'll tell you what, I've never ordered from them before, but I'm more inclined to now after seeing how well they put up with a nightmare customer like you who refuses to chill out and resolve things with them. Things eventually go wrong for everyone if you're in this business long enough, but it's how you resolve them that matters. They've done more than what's reasonable to resolve this, you just refuse to accept their offers. I still don't understand why you're unwilling to send the snake back if you're so unsatisfied.

If you still think their attempts to make things right are so bad, give this a try: Go to Walmart and buy something that's broken. Go back the next day and demand a refund (make it easy and say you'll take store credit), but tell them you aren't willing to give the item back. Tell them you'll fix the broken item yourself, but you want them to pay for your repairs. If you still think it's just bad customer service, attempt the same thing at other stores until you get the results you want. I bet you'll be trying an awfully long time before you find someone who will treat you the way you seem expect to be treated.

So your saying I should send the currently sick animal back that is being treated for that I spent my own personal money on for a refund of $245.89??? I have over $500 in him now.Which in my book he is worth more to me than that.If this is what you are saying I fill sorry for you.

Originally Posted by CwnAnnwn

Ok. Just trying to find out what would make you happy.

The second question.

If I bought a boa off you and when I got it I claimed that it had a respiratory infection, would you let me keep the animal and refund my money in cash?

You see how this turns into the world of give me free stuff because I am willing to say anything, right? The animal you received is clearly sick, but does that give you the right to a free animal?

If the animal arrived dead, you are still in the same boat. You bought the animal under TOS that clearly states store credit. I don't know a single breeder and/or seller that will give you cash back and let you keep the animal. I could be wrong. Allowing a person to get cash back and a keep the animal does not make both parties whole. It allows one party to punish the other. Because one party is out both cash and animal. The other party receives cash and animal.


The answer that everyone is trying to tell you is this...

You are not allowed to get more then you paid to them because they made a mistake.

Negotiations can not allow anyone party to try to punish the other for personal gain. You are seeking personal gain. Store credit allows them to eat less of the cost of the animal because of retail mark up. Given the mark up for the animal and the mark up for retail goods you are buying, they are out money, but not the full amount. The are probably out the same amount has it would cost to treat the problem. You get to have the animal plus get free stuff for their mistake. And for most of us, that is fair. But to demand that animal and cash is exploitive. And given the dishonest people (not you) out there, they would quickly go out of business. Everyone would get a sick snake and demand cash.

You agreed to the TOS by buying the animal in question. The TOS clearly states if there was a problem, you would accept store credit. You also agreed that you would only receive the price of the animal. If you thought this was not acceptable, then you should have never bought the animal from them.

Now, you want to know what I would do?

I would take the store credit. I would ask for it in a gift card and give it to a local reptile rescue. I would never have given this a second thought after I dropped off the gift card.

I would write this whole thing off as a lesson learned and just move on. Because life is too wonderful to run around pounding keyboards demanding people see it your way.

I was also Guaranteed a healthy snake which I did not get.