Would including a USPS MO on trades help decrease the risk posed by trades? - FaunaClassifieds
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General Business Discussions This is a general purpose forum open to business related topics concerning Reptiles and Amphibians that are neither appropriate for the Board of Inquiry, nor sales, purchase, or trade solicitations.

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Old 10-30-2005, 06:39 PM   #1
The BoidSmith
Would including a USPS MO on trades help decrease the risk posed by trades?

The "Trade and Audit forum" is a way to perform a trade with witnesses to the conditions before a transaction is conducted. After taking a nap i had a "what if" thought that would like for anyone to think about and provide your input.

You may want to say that if someone is already out to scam you he will do it one way or another and I can't deny that logic.

If things are going to go wrong they usually are with the person that ships in the second place. What if one "used" the legal system to obtain further reassurance that you will receive your shipment? The person that's running the most risk is the one shipping first, right? First you are not be sure if you will receive what you are trading for, and from there down all the other possibilties of misrepresentation. I'm trying to focus here on just one, guaranteeing that you are going to receive a package in return. Its contents or lack of them for that matter is a whole different story.

Can anyone think of some way to ensure that you will get something in return. There's not a right or wrong answer here, I would like for us to brainstorm, or at least a few sprinkles if possible

Best regards.
 
Old 10-30-2005, 08:11 PM   #2
sirenofthestorm
Using USPS money orders is a good idea, especially if you have a record of emails or other correspondence agreeing on a price and shipping terms. Isn't it a federal crime to commit mail fraud, which includes taking USPS money orders for goods and not delivering goods?

I am not sure if you can charge a money order to a credit card at the USPS, but they certainly don't take 3% off the top like paypal, and priority shipping is pretty cheap - a few days ago it cost me $5 to get a $70 USPS money order and ship it priority mail, it arrived the next day (from michigan to ohio).
 
Old 10-30-2005, 08:18 PM   #3
reptilebreeder
You mean if there is a differnt value to the trade deal? Sending the difference in a USPS MO? Doing a straight trade there wouldn't be any money involved, so I'm kind of confused as to what you are pondering.

Siren; They won't let you use a CC to buy a MO. Cash or ATM only. To much potential for fraud when you buy "money" with a credit card.
 
Old 10-30-2005, 08:49 PM   #4
The BoidSmith
Quote:
You mean if there is a differnt value to the trade deal? Sending the difference in a USPS MO? Doing a straight trade there wouldn't be any money involved, so I'm kind of confused as to what you are pondering.
John,

My thought was, what if as part of the trade one included a certain amount of cash though a USPS MO. Let us say for the sake of argument $30. If the receiving end cashes the order one has something to hold to (federal offense for not delivering what was promised). Of course if the value of the animals is in the order of let's say $300, he might choose not to cash the order and even return it to you. It will cost him just the envelope and the stamp. As Whitney says everything would have to be backed-up in writing for example through e-mails.

Example: I want to trade with someone a couple of snakes that are worth $300. I send him a money order for $30 which he is supposed to cash, and in turn send me his snakes, with another $30 order (they thus cancel out). Would that be any sort of legal protection in case he doesn't send his animals? Things that I think might go wrong with this scheme:

a. he doesn't cash the order.
b. he cashes the order but sends something completely different than was suppposed to (misrepresentation).
c. he sends an empty box and claims the sender is attempting to pull a scam on him.

Is there a way around this?

Regards.
 
Old 10-31-2005, 02:21 AM   #5
reptilebreeder
OK, I gottcha. The only time I think it may cover the situation, is if they don't send the package. It would then be mail fraud. I don't see the protection covering a disagreement over the traded animals (#b in your examples), since that would be hard to prove fraud. More of just a disagreement over quality of animals, unless it was something outright, like the e-mails and photos say that high end BP will be sent, and they sent some Kingsnakes. In a situation like that, I don't think the person (scammer) would be agreeing to that kind of a trade anyway, because it is to easy to prove. So probably a moot point.
So I guess if one is worried in a trade situation, whether they would even recieve any animals once shipped, that may work, but if it's any other kind of subjective problem, it wouldn't be of much help.

The more I think about it, the more I wonder if even in the outright fraud situation, if it would help. They could just do like you said, and send the MO back, and keep the snakes. Then you would just be back to square one, where you have to prove what you sent, that you actually sent it, and that they received it, which you would have to do anyway, whether a MO was included or not.
LOL, talking myself in circles. No wonder I've never done a trade other than with personally established contacts, or in person, if it's someone I don't know.
 
Old 10-31-2005, 02:51 AM   #6
Serpwidgets
Quote:
Originally Posted by sirenofthestorm
I am not sure if you can charge a money order to a credit card at the USPS, but they certainly don't take 3% off the top like paypal, and priority shipping is pretty cheap - a few days ago it cost me $5 to get a $70 USPS money order and ship it priority mail, it arrived the next day (from michigan to ohio).
Uhhh...
Paypal = 3% charge
USPS ($5 for a $70 MO) = 7% charge
 
Old 10-31-2005, 06:44 AM   #7
Chris@TSE
I was about to say the very same thing........
 
Old 10-31-2005, 08:54 AM   #8
The BoidSmith
Well...there's at least one way out for point a. above and that is send the money order first and have him cash it before you send out the snakes. Then you are ensuring you are receiving at least and empty box back on the mail!
 
Old 10-31-2005, 06:38 PM   #9
PaulSage
Quote:
Originally Posted by Serpwidgets
Uhhh...
Paypal = 3% charge
USPS ($5 for a $70 MO) = 7% charge
I think that includes the postage. I've never paid more than $0.90 for a PMO.


Dan, it took me a sec. to catch on to what your idea was with the using the USPS MO, but I think it would be a good one for trades with people you don't know. I would probably come up with a written agreement explaining all aspects of the trade and have the other party sign and return it before sending the animals. Just a thought.
 
Old 10-31-2005, 07:35 PM   #10
Dennis1
You know its really sux that people have to do these sort of things just so they dont get ripped off!

However I would have to really,really want the reptile to go through all of that
 

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